Skimming the Scrapheap
by SittinByTheFoulPole on Oct 10, 2008 1:20 PM EDT
87 comments
I was going to suggest somewhere on this site that maybe the Royals will take a look at signing Mike Hampton to one of the ever popular incentive-laden deals this winter… potentially add a lefty starting pitcher into the rotation mix. Sure, there’s absolutely nothing to say that Hampton can stay healthy for even a couple of spring training starts, but it might be worth a flier, right? Then I got to thinking about all of these injury-prone veteran pitchers many of us talked about at some time or another last offseason. You could put together a pretty good rotation (well, good circa 2002) with the oft injured free agent class of 2008. But did any of these guys make the investment, regardless how small, pay off? Here’s the brief list I’ve compiled and their 2008 statistics.
Bartolo Colon (BOS) – 4-2, 3.92 ERA, 27/10 K/BB, 39 IP
Jason Jennings (TEX) – 0-5, 8.56ERA, 12/18 K/BB, 27.1 IP
Freddy Garcia (DET) – 1-1, 4.20 ERA, 12/6 K/BB, 15 IP
Matt Clement (STL) – No statistics for 2007 or 2008
Mark Prior (SD) – No statistics for 2007 or 2008
Kris Benson (unsigned) – No statistics for 2007 or 2008
Jaret Wright (PIT) – No statistics for 2008, 10 IP in 2007 for BAL
Wow, clearly 2008 was an awful year for these types of signings. I believe each one of these scrapheap savants will be available again this offseason and add to the list…
Mike Hampton (ATL) – 3-4, 4.85 ERA, 38/28 K/BB, 78 IP
Carl Pavano (NYY) – 4-1, 5.77 ERA, 15/10 K/BB, 34.1 IP ($13MM club option for 2009, Wow!)
Brad Penny (LAD) – 6-9, 6.27 ERA, 51/42 K/BB, 94.2 IP ($8.75MM club option for 2009)
Mark Mulder (STL) – 0-0, 10.80 ERA, 2/2 K/BB, 1.3 IP (10 IP in 2007; $11MM club option for 2009)
So are any of these guys worth even discussing for 2009? Maybe not, but I still wouldn’t be opposed to seeing Hampton (36) signed to an incentive-laden deal given our lack of left handed starting pitching. C’mon let’s keep that Braves pipeline flowing! I mean these things work out sometimes, right? Jaret Wright was a scrapheap pickup that worked for the Braves several years ago. Thoughts? Is it best to just stay away and spend spring training and minor league rosters for evaluating younger guys?
I think for my next post I’m going to look into finding the next Gavin Floyd or dare I say, the next Kyle Davies…
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I probalby should have included their ages…
Bartolo Colon – 36
Jason Jennings – 30
Freddy Garcia – 33
Matt Clement – 33
Mark Prior – 27 (Ahh, entering his prime..)
Kris Benson – 33
Jaret Wright – 34
Mike Hampton – 36
Carl Pavano – 33
Brad Penny – 31
Mark Mulder – 31
"Greinke and the Brain" (R) (C) TM
by SittinByTheFoulPole on Oct 10, 2008 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like Jennings
Good groundball pitcher, but I don’t think he’ll be ready by opening day.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Oct 10, 2008 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmmmm. . .
I bet Penny’s option is picked up. It’s not that much and he’s pretty good and not old yet.
Right now our rotation looks like:
Meche
Greinke
Davies
Hochevar
Bannister
I think the top four are secure for the beginning of next year if healthy (and not traded off). I’ve always wanted to take a shot at Mulder, but he’s done nothing for years. I can’t imagine getting more that one good 3/4 of a season out of any of them in the rotation, and I don’t think our bullpen needs these guys.
by BrRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 1:53 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I really don't think Banny will be in the rotation by June of next year
hope I’m wrong, but…
by royalsreview on Oct 10, 2008 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The question is, are they better than the Royals current alternatives?
Right now the Royals starting pitching depth chart looks something like this:
Greinke
Meche
Hochevar
Bannister
Davies
Rosa
I’m happy with that six-deep list. The above list of FA’s each has significant problems: age, injury, and/or expense. Signing any of them doesn’t make sense for the Royals. Even if you think one or two of those pitchers are or might be better than one of the Royals above, it wouldn’t make sense to waste roster space and starts on one of those guys. We really don’t know how bad or good guys like Davies, Bannister and Rosa are. As the Royals won’t yet be in contention in 2009, it makes sense to give both of them a full season of starts to determine how good they are as the Royals start getting into contending years.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 1:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm starting to think that maybe the Royals need to go for it next season
not sure how that directly effects this discussion, but I’ll throw it out there
also, I really like the idea of initially using rosa in the bullpen, to sorta ease him into big league pitching… then again, I’d hate to see him do well there, then get stuck there forever
which is a real possibility in today’s baseball world
by royalsreview on Oct 10, 2008 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Oct 10, 2008 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1 to Rosa in the bullpen, or to going for it next year?
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1 for "throwing it out there"
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Oct 10, 2008 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Go for it before the team is ready to go for it?
The Royals can only add so much talent. Even if Glass really opens up his wallet, they aren’t going to be able to add a bunch of impact players. Guys like Gordon, Butler and Hochevar would have to take a really big step forward next year in order for “going for it” to be at all doable. I don’t think next year is the year because there isn’t enough talent on the current team to make us close. You go for it when you’re close and need some impact players to put you over the top. I just don’t see why 2009 would be the year to go for it. 2010 would make more sense, particularly if we see improvement from Butler, Gordon and Hochevar and Aviles doesn’t regress too much.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 3:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
And you can steadily improve without going nuts, and perhaps end up “going for it.” That’s how I interpret what happened with the Rays.
The Royals situation is differrent, of course They don’t’ need to go nuts this offseason, and shouldn’t. But given the relative weakness of the AL Central, a Gordon and Butler developing, and a smart, cheap addition or two in the offseason, and the Royals might luck their way into divisional contention next season without breaking the bank, and still be set for the years following.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
gordon has to improve/break out at some point, right?
ditto for Butler
the division looks pretty weak next year
by royalsreview on Oct 10, 2008 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's see if they break out next year
If they do, then 2010 would be the perfect time to go for it.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My expert projection is
conservatively, something like .270/.365/.470 season for Gordon next year. I dunno if that’s quite a breakout…
Butler, who knows. He’s really young.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
is it settled that soria will remain a closer?
by royalsreview on Oct 10, 2008 2:03 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Dayton says yes
Soria remains closer for now although he’s recently said others in the organization do favor trying him as a starter.
"Greinke and the Brain" (R) (C) TM
by SittinByTheFoulPole on Oct 10, 2008 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know we've discussed it incessantly around here
but any consideration of what the Royals should do with regard to starting pitching has to include a discussion of Soria in the rotation.
Yes, I know DMGM said recently that, on his call, Soria is staying in the rotation, but again, we’re talking about what makes sense that the Royals should do.
If, as many of us believe, Soria should be in the rotation, that’s one more big reason that spending much money on a FA reclamation project when the offense needs help so badly.
If we take NYRoyal’s list above, the Royals then are 7 deep for potential starters.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 2:05 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Let me add that
the refusal to try Soria in the rotation, if not based on health concerns, is precisely the sort of unimaginative thinking a team in the Royals situation can’t afford.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
+1
I absolutey agree. I guess I’m probably going too much by what GMDM has said recently, but that’s all I really have to go besides speculation. He and Hillman have certainly expressed interest in acquiring another starting pitcher and I’d rather see this kind of a low risk, high reward signing than, say, going after Oliver Perez (who I think would get torched in the AL or even a third tier guy like Randy Wolf or Paul Byrd. I’m certainly not advocating spending much on any of these guys. That’s for sure.
"Greinke and the Brain" (R) (C) TM
by SittinByTheFoulPole on Oct 10, 2008 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also
The Royals have been pretty famously unimaginative… Gload still getting way too many starts, Aviles not getting called up sooner and then riding the pine for a week after an 0-3, Brazell, Shealy rotting away in AAA without getting a look on bad teams. I had a quote hanging in my room when I was growing up that said, “Sanity is the playground of the unimaginative.” Perhaps, the Royals FO has been all too sane in recent years!
"Greinke and the Brain" (R) (C) TM
by SittinByTheFoulPole on Oct 10, 2008 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
I was really hopeful that Dayton and Trey seemed like innovative “outside the box” thinkers and while they’re not as stick in the mud as Buddy Bell, they’re not terribly creative.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Oct 10, 2008 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hillman is understandable
he’s a novice and probably worried about his job security
but dayton’s MO appears to be being as conservative/status quo/standard as possible in his thinking, and just planning on doing that better than everyone else
by royalsreview on Oct 10, 2008 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It is the Bravest Way
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Oct 10, 2008 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The only comfort I can take from Dayton's comments
are that some people in the organization were in favor of trying this.
It’s ironic – if Soria had merely been adequate at relieving instead of outstanding, they probably never would have traded Dotel, or at least, Soria wouldn’t have been trusted to close, and then, after easing in for a year or two, they ALMOST CERTAINLY would have tried him as a starter.
I’ve heard Moore state two different reasons for not moving Soria. Earlier, he stated that he had concerns about his delivery not translating; i.e., he implied a health risk. Later, since the season has ended, he has also stated that although he thinks Soria could be a good starter, he is inclined to keep him there due to the “this game is now over” factor that he brings.
I agree with devil_fingers completely – the Royals are not in any kind of position to ignore a potential 5+ winshare gain from moving him to the rotation. It is very unimaginative to not at least try him as a starter.
David Glass can change my mind on this – just go out and spend the money to acquire another pitcher at least as good as Greinke or Meche. Keep in mind, this will cost the team about 15 or 20 million, and will most likely preclude the acquistion of the “big bat” we are in even more need of.
by loyal2sdad on Oct 10, 2008 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Great point
Soria is being punished for excelling at his job.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Oct 10, 2008 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
don't know about Soria
but the fans sure are, whether they know it or not
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Accidental Closer
We always did feel the same, We just saw it from a different point of view, Tangled up in blue.
-Bob Dylan
by Royal Kingdom on Oct 10, 2008 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
if soria would have just sucked, we could have put him in the pen.
leave it alone. We have bigger problems.
Don't forget to send your broken maples to the US Forest Service.
by 306008 on Oct 10, 2008 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
pen=rotation!
Don't forget to send your broken maples to the US Forest Service.
by 306008 on Oct 10, 2008 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Unless, you know,
he’d rather stay a closer, in which case he’s being rewarded.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Oct 12, 2008 3:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wouldn't It Be
Nice to have that “this game is over now” factor in the 1st inning?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Oct 10, 2008 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Brian Bannister managed that several times this year
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 7:42 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Try To Think
Positive; I know it’s a foreign concept, but try.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Oct 12, 2008 1:45 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I thought I was one of the positive ones (Heck, I even still like Mark Teahen)?
I like Banny, and think he’ll be better, but I have to be honest, too.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 12, 2008 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
DMGM +/-
I think DMGM has been pretty good so far. Not perfect. I’m trying to think of what could get me to want him gone… all GMs make mistakes… also, his rebuild of the minors is something that is great. ON the other hand, comparing him with previous regimes needs to be discounted a bit because he has more of a financial free hand. Leaving aside the minors, I’m going to list a few things DMGM could do with the major league team that would make me think better of him, and a few things that would Really PIss Me Off in terms of not just the moves, but what it says about Moore. Moore could, of course, mix and match… this assumes the money to sign one major free agent in the offseason. And it’s not all about signing guys, which anyone can do given the right amount of Money.
These lists are not exhaustive, nor do I claim to know how likelly any of this is.
Moves That Would Impress Me
1. Resigning Zack Greinke to the sort of reasonable extension NYRoyal has posted
2. Moving Soria to the rotation (in a smart, safe interval)
3. Failing to resign Zack, and trading him for 2-3 stud prospects, at least 1-2 who are MLB-ready hitters
4. Deciding that Soria can’t move to the rotation, and trading him for at least 1 young stud hitter, at least a Matt Kemp type
5. Getting a healthy Rafael Furcal for no more than 3/39 or 4/42 or somet other reasonable deal
6. Getting Dunn or Burrell for no more than 3/50 (maybe 4/60 or something for Dunn)
7. Trading Guillen and most/all of his salary for a bag of peanuts (this would be truly impressive)
8. If Dunn or Burrell can’t be got, and/or Guillen is traded, signing Eric Hinske or Juan Rivera to short contracts, say, 2/12 or so with a third year club option. If Guillen is gone and no big names are signed, sign both of them.
Moves That Would Piss Me Off:
1. Refusing to move Soria to the Rotation because “if it’s broke, don’t fix it.”
2. Signing Rafael Furcal for 5/80
3. Holding on to Jose Guillen even after he OPSes .900 in May and June
4. Trading Billy Butler for Jeff Francoeur
5. Trading anything more than filler and spare parts for Jeff Francoeur
6. Not making Hillman play Billy Butler every day at DH or first
7. Ross Gload getting more than spot starts over Butler, Shealy, and/or McBroomerton
8. Retaining TPJ over Esteban German, McBroomerton, or Joel Peralta
9. Ross Gload being on the major league roster in July
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"aint broke"
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sadly
“If its broke, don’t fix it” was the mantra of the Allard Baird era.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Oct 10, 2008 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
also the Ross Gload era
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
One addition to the Piss Me Off list
10. Moving Alex Gordon to First Base.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like your lists
What would you put on your lists about Kila Ka’aihue? What could they do with him that would impress you or piss you off?
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ditto on the Catcher situation Olivo/Buck/Pena??
We always did feel the same, We just saw it from a different point of view, Tangled up in blue.
-Bob Dylan
by Royal Kingdom on Oct 10, 2008 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My take on the catcher situation
Olivo is gone. He has a mutual option and Olivo wants out. And there is every reason to believe that his contract includes a clause that says the Royals have to waive their arbitration rights to him. So I really don’t think he’s an option unless the Royals want to throw a bunch of money at him, and he’s not worth a bunch of money.
So I think the only thing that really makes sense is keeping Buck (and paying him arbitration money around $3M) and having Pena as his backup. I’d be willing to sign a decent backup catcher instead of using Pena if the Royals don’t end up spending much money on a big FA this offseason.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can't tell if I'm being mocked by you all or not
But I’m a sucker for even false flattery
Kila. U dunno. I mean, I do know, but I guess it seems pretty clear to me that Moore is doing the obviously right thing in this case.
Bring him to Spring Training, reassure him that going back to Omaha is not a criticism, send him to Omaha to start the year unless Ross Gload suddenly shows he can OPS .800, Ryan Shealy gets hit by a bus, AND a anvil falls out of a transport plane onto Billy Butler’s head.
If Kila starts to rake, and Shealy isn’t doing anything more than what we expect (.780 OPS tops, if he hits against RHP, too), then bring him up in June. Again, that assumes he continues something like what he was doing in Omaha through April and May. If he’s struggling a bit, or needs more time, give it to him He’s not THAT old… Maybe he won’t be ready until later. Maybe he won’t be ready until 2010. In Neither case is he a bust. I mean, if he bombs in Omaha next year, yeah, that will suck. But It’s not like if he needs one more year in AAA he’s done. Shealy and Butler can handle it between the two of them.
I’m not sure what DMGM is likely to do with Kila to piss me off… the stuff related to Kila that would piss me off has more to do with Butler and Gload.
Catching. I’m not quite Jason Whitlock to John Buck’s Jeff George, but, like NHZ, I’ll admit that there’s just something about the guy. PrOPS shows that this year Olivo was very lucky, and Buck was unlucky, keep him around at least one more year as the main starter. I still think there’s Mike Stanley potential in there somewhere. Maybe he can have a power surge/lucky BABIP year like Kelly Shoppach. I don’t think it’s likely, but he seems to be a similar hitter.
If they want to bring back Olivo and he understands his role, fine. Don’t jettison Buck in favor of Olivo — that would show the short-sighted, limited imagination that would Piss Me Off.
Brayan Pena as a backup would be fine. Bringing in Josh Bard or Javier Valentin at the right price as part-timers would be fine. I’d be thrilled with Gregg Zaun, too, although that would definitely cause a conflict in my irrational loyalties…
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow... got mixed up in the middle of a sentence.. igore the "Gload 800 OPS thing"
Also, the point about Kila is that it would take something totally unimaginable for them to piss me off — trade him for nothing, bring him up to start the season and send Butler down, something idiotic like that
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
DF, I appreciate the self-deprecation, but your analysis and opinion is highly valued by me and many other people. Long story short, your opinions are as valuable as anybody’s and more valuable than most (IMO).
On Kila, Shealy and Gload. I agree with your plan. So this means it wouldn’t piss you off to have Gload and Shealy share time at 1B/DH? (to be clear, we all agree Butler should play everyday at either DH or 1B, and my question involves Gload and Shealy sharing time as the other half of the 1B/DH role). It seems likely that this is going to happen, and it appears that many people would be pissed with Gload being on the 25-man roster, much less being a roughly half-time starter. I guess the short question is, what kind of Gload role, or amount of Gload playing time next year would piss you off?
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, I could live with that much Gload
although, frankly, I think Teahen could handle the “other” part of the 1B platoon if the Royals wnated to keep someone else, like German/Maier/Gathright on the roster.
I have a long, stupid post coming out on DHs and stuff. I’ve probably been a little hard on Gload, since his D was legitimately good last year. It did suck this year, but others have pointed out that 1B defense is a bit like Catcher defense in that the metrics don’t quite get the “catching throws” element of 1B.
I’m fine with Gload as a part-timer as long as he isn’t blocking other guys time. But, even though Shealy isn’t a star, I think he should be given a bit of a leash to “fail” himself into a platoon role next April
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My 2008 1B/DH plan if I were GM
1. Butler plays essentially everyday, most of the time at 1B.
2. Ka’aihue starts the season in Omaha.
3. Shealy and Gload share time in a roughly 50/50 split at whatever 1B/DH position Butler isn’t playing that day (to start the season)
4. If Kila hits well in April and May, then call him up. “Hits well” meaning a .900+ OPS.
5. If Kila is called up, bench/DFA/outright Gload.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sounds like the one sure obvious plan this season
On a slightly related topic: what’s the difference between DFA and outrighting?
The Royals are still on the hook for the salary either way, right? What’s the harm in just DFAing Gload and seeing if he refuses the assignment? Why would anyone outright cut a player?
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hate the byzantine MLB player personnel rules
On a slightly related topic: what’s the difference between DFA and outrighting?
I won’t pretend to know all of the ins and outs, but I know some of them and let’s look at Gload’s situation. They would have to DFA him first. That immediately takes him off the 40-man roster and allows someone to replace him (like Kila). The Royals would then have 10 days to release, trade or waive him. A team could claim him off waivers and would then have to pay all of his remaining salary. If no one claimed him, the Royals could then outright him to the minors. As he has a guaranteed major league contract, he could refuse the assignment, making him a free agent. But because of his service time, refusing the assignment would void the remainder of his major league contract. Or he could accept the assignment, go to the minors and keep getting the big paychecks. So, in short, the Royals would have to DFA, then outright him (unless someone else claims him or they trade him).
So yes the Royals could DFA him right now. I thought they should DFA and then outright him back in June (and every month since then). But if the plan is to start the season with him on the 25-man roster, there’s no benefit in DFAing him now. If another team might have interest in him, then Moore should shop him and see if someone will take him off our hands for a bag of beans.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gload
Gload passed the five-year MLB service time threshold earlier this season, so as a five-year player, he gets paid regardless of whether he refuses the outright assignment. He is now a 100% sunk cost.
by Gopherballs on Oct 10, 2008 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
shi-ite
Then I guess we have to put a hit out on him.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
have him hunt with Cheny
Go Royals!
by BabyBlues on Oct 10, 2008 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As I understand it....
DFAing a player is a prerequisite to outrighting them to the minors. When a player gets DFAed, they have to be released, traded, or placed on waivers within 10 days. Only if the player then clears waivers can he be outrighted to the minors, and this can only be done once without the player’s consent—afterwards, if the player is outrighted to the minors, he can demand his release instead.
by DarthYoshi on Oct 10, 2008 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I mostly agree, with one small exception
I would probably platoon Gload and Shealy instead of giving them 50/50 splits on the ABs.
I would also rather sign Hinske and just dump Gload now, but I realize that probably won’t happen.
by DarthYoshi on Oct 10, 2008 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would probably platoon Gload and Shealy instead of giving them 50/50 splits on the ABs.
I hear what you’re saying and there is a certain logic in that. But the problem is that if you platoon them, then Gload gets 3/4 of the starts and Shealy gets 1/4. I’d like to see more of Shealy than that. We still don’t now how good of a major league hitter he is. So I’d like him to to get at least half-time PT. Gload is past his peak and isn’t improving. We know what he is. I might even give Shealy more PT than Gload.
I would also rather sign Hinske and just dump Gload now, but I realize that probably won’t happen.
I’m not against that idea either.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let me clarify about Gload and Shealy
(and this is really my fault for not including this in my original post)
Gload and Shealy both are statistical mutants in that Gload, as a LH batter, hits LH pitching about as well as he does RH pitching, and Shealy hits RH pitching much better than he does LH pitching (their career splits would support this). It would be totally counterintuitive, but platooning Shealy and Gload so that Shealy started against RHPs and Gload started against LHPs might actually work. And that way, Shealy would be getting more PT than Gload.
by DarthYoshi on Oct 10, 2008 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting idea
I think that’s one of those things that makes sense and might work well, but it is too outside-the-box for a MLB manager to actually do it.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The reverse splits look like a small sample size and BABIP fluke
Neither Gload nor Shealy have many at bats against pitchers with the same handedness (Gload has 241 and Shealy has 151). The BABIP seem fluky too — Shealy’s BABIP is .232 v. LHP (.381 v. RHP), while Gload’s BABIP is .336 v. LHP (.304 v. RHP).
by Gopherballs on Oct 10, 2008 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shealy has 422 PA's against righties, not 151
You’re right about the extremity of Shealy’s Babip, but Gload’s isn’t that extreme at all. And for a LH batter, Gload has a decent number of AB’s (about half a season’s worth, if you project 500ish AB’s a season). Many LH batters simply don’t get that many AB’s against LH pitchers, it is a fact of life. Gload has a relatively large sample size.
by DarthYoshi on Oct 10, 2008 7:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That should have been "opposite handedness"
In the majors, Shealy has only 151 AB v. LHP (387 AB v. RHP). Combined with his BABIP v. LHP (.232), his performance against LHP screams small sample size-influenced fluke. He also has pretty sizable regular platoon splits in the minors. In his last four years in AAA, his OPS is 1.034 v. LHP (271 AB) and 877 v. RHP (875 AB).
As for Gload, half a season of ABs is a relatively small sample size. Just ask 2006 Mark Teahen. The bigger problem is he not very good against LHP or RHP.
If either gets enough ABs in the majors, the reverse splits will disappear.
by Gopherballs on Oct 11, 2008 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
not to mention Cortez in second half and possibly Tejeda
Go Royals!
by BabyBlues on Oct 10, 2008 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Matt Clement
Has the potential to be a solid closer someday with that devastating curveball, but I guess he was downright horrible in the minors this year and is not close to being MLB ready.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Oct 10, 2008 2:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
About the only pitcher on that list I'd be interested in signing is
Brad Penny. But, like BrRoyal, I think his option will be picked up. If it isn’t, I’d be fine with throwing him a 2-year deal, but I think we would be outbid by another team.
But given the choice, I’d rather invest what FA money we have available into bolstering the lineup.
by DarthYoshi on Oct 10, 2008 2:24 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure more than six guys on that list will ever pitch again in the majors
Penny really should not be on that list.
by Gopherballs on Oct 10, 2008 2:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I think Soria's future role with the Royals depends on how other starting pitchers perform
If the Royals keep Greinke beyond 2010, Meche continues to pitch well, Hochevar continues to develop and is a solid #3 or better, and two of Davies/Bannister/Rosa/Cortes become at least pretty good starting pitchers, then I think we’ll never see Soria as a starting pitcher for the Royals. If, however, one of those things doesn’t happen, and it appears that there is a significant hole in the rotation, then I could see Moore giving the go ahead to move Soria into the rotation.
I don’t think this is how the decision should be made, because Soria would likely be a significant improvement over the #5 starter, no matter who he is. But I think that is how the decision will be made.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 3:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
sigh...
I guess this is better than the royals keeping him as a setup man at least (a la Joba)
by royalsreview on Oct 10, 2008 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They Yankees keep going back and forth
A few weeks ago, they “official word” from the Yankees was that Joba would be in the pen next year. A week ago, the “official word” I heard reported was that he’d be a starter. I have a feeling he’ll end up going back and forth between the pen and the rotation next year as players get hurt or underperform.
The one thing that keeps me from being totally pissed about Soria languishing in the bullpen is the concern over his mechanics. No one really knows how much of a risk there is in having him throw 200 innings (even if slowly worked up to that) with his mechanics, which are definitely a concern.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Oct 10, 2008 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and he weighs 120 pounds
I wanna know what love is, I want you to show me
by LeoBloom on Oct 10, 2008 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess that reminds me
that even though DMGM may be making the wrong decision, at least he is being decisive and committed regarding Soria. That is a good thing.
We always did feel the same, We just saw it from a different point of view, Tangled up in blue.
-Bob Dylan
by Royal Kingdom on Oct 10, 2008 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you forgot to add "brave"
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought Freddy Garcia looked decent for the tigers at the end
I wanna know what love is, I want you to show me
by LeoBloom on Oct 10, 2008 4:14 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
he did... he'd be a decent pickup for cheap if he goes cheap.
I still think we should just give lowe a contract that tops all the others.
Grienke, Lowe, Meche, Hochevar, Davies and we have as good of rotation as there is in the AL Central.
Don't forget to send your broken maples to the US Forest Service.
by 306008 on Oct 10, 2008 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I dunno
he might be decent picture, but he and Soria might have serious tension over the Most Awesome Amish Beard On A Latin Guy on the Royals.
Coupled with a potential Cuddyer/Guillen battle over “most out of position” player… yikes…
CONFUSION IN THE CLUBHOUSE
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 10, 2008 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would not sign Lowe
for two reasons: first, he’s ancient, and his arm is going to have to give at some point. And second (tying into #1), he will likely come extremely expensive and will likely want multiple years. At most, the Royals may need a stopgap starter for a year or two. If Cortes does well in the PCL next year, I think he’ll merit a September call-up and a legit shot at the rotation during 2010 spring training. Rosa should compete for a spot on the 25-man roster this year. After 2010, hopefully some combination of Cegerra, Duffy, et al will be close to MLB-ready.
by DarthYoshi on Oct 10, 2008 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
This just made me smile
I just got to thinking how most of these guys would normally be our top priority during some of the Baird years.
To fall is not failure, failure is refusing to get up
by ksuroyals on Oct 12, 2008 12:28 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
You should never sign a guy whose name is one letter away from being
Bad Penny.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Oct 12, 2008 4:02 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Was he " with" Alyssa Milano before or after Barry Zito
not sure which devalued her more
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Oct 12, 2008 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He Was "With"
Barry Zito? Not that there’s anything wrong with that………………
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Oct 12, 2008 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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