Game 29 Open Thread - Royals (12-16) at Indians (14-15)
by Freneau on May 3, 2008 6:30 PM EDT
in Events
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PrintKansas City Royals at Cleveland Indians, May 2, 2008 7:05 PM EDT
Let's try this again...
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OK. Back to baseball.
Our Royals look to claw their way out of last place (last place already?) this weekend in Cleveland. RR Fest hero Luke Hochevar (5.91 ERA) looks to build on a nice start against the Blue Jays, while the Tribe counters with C.C. Sabathia (7.87 ERA) who just looks corpulent.
If you don't mind, here's a snippet I posted last week, only to have it get lost in the site crash:
Shifting gears, as many of you know, I have some Cleveland ties, and lived there last summer (and will be back there in about a month). I'm not sure if every fanbase feels this way, but there is a definite meme in Cleveland that the Royals always give us trouble. I've heard it personally, heard it on the radio, seen it on Lets Go Tribe and on and on. Well, let's check the facts:
Cleveland's Record Against the Royals Since 2001:
2002: 9-102003: 6-132004: 11-82005: 13-62006: 10-82007: 11-7Total Since 2001: 61-42
So nope, the Royals don't really give the Tribe any trouble. Other than those few years when the Indians are really bad and the Royals are ok.
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my prediction for the game
royals lose 6-2
by Billybutlerformvp on May 2, 2008 6:53 PM EDT reply actions
Let's hope
C.C. isn’t on his game again tonight…..
Oh no, Rain, we might be in for a crappy night.
by I need more Esteban on May 2, 2008 7:01 PM EDT reply actions
I have a feeling
that how Hochevar pitches tonight has a causal relationship with the speed of John Bale’s recovery.
+1
last shot before commerical looked dark and it was pouring. Damn, what am I going to do at work now?
by I need more Esteban on May 2, 2008 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions
any more info on likelihood of playing?
by Royal Revival on May 2, 2008 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Still expecting to play
there will be another update at the top of the hour.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
can i just say...
the last TWO times I have bitched about gordon not batting 3rd, the next day, he’s been batting third
Game Canceled.. See Ya Tomorrow
A lot of you wont like me... by I assure you my opinion will be voiced GO ROYALS!
They just said on the TV broadcast that the game will be delayed
but they should get it in.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
(Set X Foils for Attack Position!)
Red 5 Standing By
I really don't know what to say... Did the post above this signature make sense? Probably not.
by RoyalsFanInMarinerTown on May 3, 2008 6:33 PM EDT reply actions
Only 3 Lefties
But Gordon stays in the 3-hole.
D. DeJesus cf 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .354
M. Grudzielanek 2b 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .316
A. Gordon 3b 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .292
J. Guillen lf 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .176
B. Butler 1b 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .291
M. Teahen rf 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .269
M. Olivo dh 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .233
J. Buck c 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .225
T. Pena Jr. ss 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .152
Totals 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Olivo gets to play…...kinda.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
He said "maybe they'll trade me."
He’ll be a cancer in the clubhouse any day now.
I probably disagree with you.
by Scott McKinney on May 3, 2008 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions
It Looks Like
They’ll be playing soon.
http://radar.weather.gov/ridge/Conus/centgrtlakes_loop.php
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
I was waiting for you to come through with the weather update.
I almost asked where you were with the forecast.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
this is a good time in the semester
at least here at Iowa… one week of class to go, not stressful yet, etc.
oh hey
an out on the basepaths? that never happens…
Accidentally not thedude925 anymore. I do hate this new name.
and that is our offense in a nutshell
a fucking leadoff double and we cant score it.
pathetic
Accidentally not thedude925 anymore. I do hate this new name.
Guillie Just Missed
A double; he gets around on the inside fastball well. Too bad about DDJ at home; it was close.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
RoyalsReview
I was going to post this as a fanpost but since it is just you and me it can go here I guess.
I know this week has been hard on bloggers and you especially because of the ESPN/Grass Creek article. But I wanted to commend you for the environment you have created here. I know that some have called this their own little on line pub and I suppose that is somewhat accurate. I howoever, have a different view. I hale from a small Kansas farming town and this is like the small town cafe for me. It is the place where we meet and discuss the events that matter to our common interest, argue about the merits of changes, and hope for a better future. There are those here who are cranky or at least contrarians(sp?), those who provide insight to our future, those who can recall our history, and those who just show up to hang out and talk shop. This place is a reflection of all of those people , but most of all it is a reflection of you and your hard work. The reason we all come back is because you have created a comfortable place where ideas can grow and opinions are aired freely. Thank you for this.
I know a little sappy but it is true and we all appreciate your work, however unprofitable it may be.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
thanks man
I appreciate it. The vibe here is great. I don’t know if it’s a midwestern thing or what, but it really is pretty cool.
Hooch Is Rocking
The Eastwood thing with that flat bill pulled down low. Billy actually mad the force unassisted at 1B; impressive.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
He Was Safe
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 8:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah but he probably could have made it easier to call by running.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
3-2, Buck's Running
TPJ at the plate; it just doesn’t get any better.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
Actually, The Team
Has done pretty well on that account; just my subjective impression.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 8:51 PM EDT up reply actions
They have done remarkably well, for them.
I was referring to royalsreview’s question about who would see more pitches Olivo or TPJ
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
V-Mart Could Not
Havew reached that with a broomstick.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
Hochevar Short-Arms
A pitch every once in a while, and ball 4 was one.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
I know that one could say that power numbers have dropped (re Hafner)
because of no more steroids for hitters. But I wonder if some of it is that you have fewer pitchers who are roided up but have no clue where the ball is going? The type of guys who supplied a lot of the power because they were fringe players stuff wise, but got the call due to throwing 95+ on the juice.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
it's really hard to say, there are a million factors
Hafner is decievng because he started his big league career pretty late, and he hasnt been around long, but is already declining
I wanna know what love is, I want you to show me
He Already Has
The grit; veteran presence is coming along nicely.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 9:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Does he "hustle"
and play the game the “right” way. Otherwise I don’t want him on my team, contributions be damned.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
He can walk anyone he wants if he continues to get
DPs and strikeouts to get out of the inning without damage.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
Coming In To
Sizemore was not a good idea; something about discretion and valor?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 9:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Has anyone invented
a fielding independent hitting statistic. Many times you will hear an announcer say he it is hitting the ball hard but right at people. I think it would be good to know if there is something a bit more refined than BABIP, perhaps using line drive % etc.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
Olivo Will Go
Yard; you heard it here first.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
Missed It By
That much.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions
If Sabathia had fallen down there
we would have felt it in KC, hell phil may have felt it in Alaska.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
3-2, 2 Out
Runners at 2B and 3B, TPJ on deck; you have to swing.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
i'm amazed that the game is actually on TV tonight
and now i’m enthralled by it ;)
Let’s see how things turn out. Let’s go Royals, yeah?
Boyfriend of the Year 2008: It's gonna be big!
V-Mart Is
A great hitter; he’ll be at 1B soon.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
All hell just broke loose on the nascar race that I hav on in the background (crashes are cool)
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
We Just Had
One of our own here. 3-2 short-arm in the dirt, BB/WP run in .
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions
are you kidding skirra?
i’m ALWAYS bad luck.
fucking Royals, trying to hate on me.
Boyfriend of the Year 2008: It's gonna be big!
Billy The Dancing
Bear comes through; disaster averted for now.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
How's That?
Hooch has not fooled Sizemore at all today.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Who Had The
Most HR’s for KC in the 90’s?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
I Never Would
Have thought of him, but it makes sense.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 9:57 PM EDT up reply actions
the royals just had so much roster movement in the 1990s
yu have random appearances by guys… then they move on
We're Only 4
Errors from tying it up.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Really though, Hochevar is pitching ok tonight.
He needs to cut down on the walks, but this performance is encouraging to me. If he can do this consistently, and Meche can improve, we’ll have a pretty awesome 1-4 rotation.
Agreed
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 10:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Why Does A
2-out single by Butler not thrill me?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
My Very Word
That was my next post. Muat is my neologism of the day.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Uno, Dos, Tres
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions
This team is a joke
5 games under, 12-17. One of the worst in baseball…
winning records follow good bullpens
I would say that one component of this team is a joke.
The pitching has been good enough to win games, but gets no consistent help from the offense.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
This offense is absof'inglutely terrible
It’s beyond bad, it has to be the worst in baseball outside of the Giants. I would rather have the Twins collection of nobodies at this point. So far GMDM has shown me NOTHING at all in terms of pointing together an offense. He looks clueless.
winning records follow good bullpens
Hooch Is Pitching
Like he wants Red Lobster.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
This is the hidden problem with BA offense.
Cleveland has two runs on three hits because they got walks and got a homer – power and patience. We have no runs on six hits because most of the hits are singles and the players before or after those hits struck out or hit into double plays.
The real problem is, I’m not sure that GM Moore realizes the significance of institutional valuing of power and patience over BA. If he does not get that, our team is not going to win, even if he has the correct pitching philosophies.
Clearly BA should never be discussed in player deveopment/acuisition meetings
held by the baseball operations guys.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
I'm more worried about about a quote I read a while back . . .
but I;m not sure where. It was comparing Billy Beane, who has an institutional rule that propects must average so many walks before they are allowed to progress, to GMDM who said his philosophy was to let players swing, find “what pitches they can’t hit” and then learn to lay off those pitches and take walks. The problem I see reflected in Billy Butler and Alex Gordon is that in confident players, this kind of philosophy leads to them swinging at way too much, and getting singles instead of waiting for a pitch to drive. I am afraid GMDM’s hitter development philosophy will prevent us from ever developing patient power hitters.
What's really frustrating is that GMDM
Is clearly awesome at developing and identifying pitching talent, more so than any other recent GM. And it really sucks that we finally get a GM that can give us general competence and good pitching, and he is on the wrong side of the SLG-OBP/BA development philosophy. About all I can hope for is the Royals get good-hitting Free Agents, but that is hard to do in KC.
I just worry
that instead we will waste another two years trying to fix the problem by having more speed
6 k's in 6 innings is pretty sexy
Too bad he walked 4. Whatever, 2 runs in six innings is a fantastic effort from your 5th starter against perhaps the best team in the division. Oh, wait – we can’t score. Doesn’t matter anyway.
winning records follow good bullpens
Hafner Spoiled A
Great 0-2 pitch, but the next one was just as good. I like what I see.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
Can we scor ethis runner?
Million dollar question
winning records follow good bullpens
DDJ Hacking, But
It works. That pitch was in his eyes.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
DDJ is a stud
Must score at least one more.
winning records follow good bullpens
It's on Gordon...no pressure
winning records follow good bullpens
Vaudeville Lives In
RF here in Cleveland.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
Gordon is clutch
Let’s go for the kill
winning records follow good bullpens
10 hits, 2 runs
Epic
winning records follow good bullpens
You ninja'd me.
I was going to make the same point – this is slap-happy baseball at its best.
It's "the Royals way"
at least in the last few years. How many times have we made this complain on this site for the past years?
I don't care how scrilegious it is - I want a Red Sox offense circa 2004 . . .
The kind where every guy takes a ton of pitches, and practically anyone can hit a home run.
The “right way” can take a hike.
Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
winning records follow good bullpens
You know, he didn't have to do much at all
And he couldn’t even do that.
winning records follow good bullpens
This is the department of clutch hitting, phoning Billy Butler
Coming into work today?
winning records follow good bullpens
Double, single, single, single, single
Including a bunt single, and a sac bunt. Some old Japanese dude would be proud. 3 run home run plz?
winning records follow good bullpens
Perez is pretty nasty though
winning records follow good bullpens
It would be really funny if . . .
Teahen got a single or a walk here, and Olivo made the last out. We would have batted all the way around, and scored only 3 runs – the exact minimum for batting around.
Well, Except For
Guillie.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Yessssssss. Insurance runs.
winning records follow good bullpens
Are We Allowed
To do that?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow, how did we only score 4 runs there?
Time for the bullpen to be good.
winning records follow good bullpens
love those singles
thank god for Grudz’s totally pointless bunt too
i’m sure we’ll hear all about how critical that was
I didn't really mind the bunt
Gordon has hit into a lot of DP’s this year / K’d a lot, and we couldn’t afford to not score there. Plus the sinkhole that is Jose Guillen is hitting behind him, and sure enough he couldn’t even score the runner from third.
winning records follow good bullpens
Let it be aknowledged . . .
Hillman did the right thing pulling Hochevar here, both in terms of pitch counts and game situation.
Smooth Mahay . . .
walk the #9 hitter right in front of Sizemore.
I wouldn't be opposed as long as he can pitch tomorrow night also
On the otherhand, Ramon Ramirez has been pure filth up until this point also.
winning records follow good bullpens
I'm with you
Sidenote: I’m a little lost on rules for winning pitchers. If we hold on, Hooch is still in line for the win, right?
And don’t worry, I threw practically every anti-jinx into this post short of sacrificing a goat in a Sabathia jersey…
by RoyalsFanInBillings on May 3, 2008 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Hear, Hear!
Mahay missed a pitch to Sizemore by 6 feet at least. El Guapo needs the work.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 10:54 PM EDT up reply actions
This team sure looks a lot better when the bottom of the lineup gets on base
winning records follow good bullpens
Anybody else notice Justin Verlander is now 1-5?
I’ve watched all his starts this year, and there is definitely something different about him. He’s obviously very talented, but it looks like the beginners luck has worn off to a certain extent.
winning records follow good bullpens
At times I wonder if he has a bat in his hand while swinging
then he grounds one back to the pitcher
winning records follow good bullpens
So does this mean Nunez has officially lost the set up job to Ramirez?
winning records follow good bullpens
For the time being, I'd say yes.
Ramirez is more likely to get the K, I think, so less likely to let the batter put the ball in play, and I’d almost prefer stretching Nunez out to a middle relief, two-inning kind of guy.
But I’m against having set roles for relief pitchers anyway. I’d rather keep it flexible, aside from the closer, and then only grudgingly.
by RoyalsFanInBillings on May 3, 2008 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Tying run to da plate
winning records follow good bullpens
When can we start calling him Ram Ram
winning records follow good bullpens
Fantasy baseball be damned.
I want to to V-Mart hit into a DP right now.
by RoyalsFanInBillings on May 3, 2008 11:03 PM EDT reply actions
As long as the Royals are in such a generous mood on my requests...
I’d like one more insurance run this inning, and a perfect ninth from Soria for the save.
Is that being greedy?
by RoyalsFanInBillings on May 3, 2008 11:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes on the first, no on the second.
The Royals scored 4 runs already . . . now you want more? How ungrateful.
Ramon Ramirez just got 3 outs on 6 pitches
winning records follow good bullpens
Makes sense
cause nothing is more exciting then watching someone else play cards
by RoyalsFanInBillings on May 3, 2008 11:04 PM EDT up reply actions
ITS OFFICIAL, I FREAKIN' HATE FSN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
WENT TO POKER IN KC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have many leather bound books...
Dos, Tres
Inning over. I’m beginning to believe in Rami.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
Set up man and Closer
Ram Ram and Walk Sore…there’s a joke in there somewhere.
I have many leather bound books...
I Have My
Best people on it.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Man, we have 5 bullpen guys I have a ton of confidence in:
Soria
Nunez
Ramirez
Gobble
Mahay
I mean, we need some long relief (bale anyone?) but when our starting pitching goes at least 6 innings we really don’t need anyone else.
If We Can
Find a dependable 5th starter.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 3, 2008 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Of course, it doesn't matter what our pitchers do
if we can’t score runs…which makes today’s game (thus far) so sweet. Run production + solid starting pitching + outstanding relief work = happiness.
by RoyalsFanInBillings on May 3, 2008 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions
No more runs tonight guys
It’s up to the man crush of Royals nation, Joakim Soria to deliver us the most holy of holy wins… The defeat of CC Sabathia.
winning records follow good bullpens
These games are a whole lot of foreplay, and if we get lucky some climax
But we aren’t getting lucky often enough
winning records follow good bullpens
That curveball is ridiculous
winning records follow good bullpens
Jesus, they stood no chance
winning records follow good bullpens
Tell me Joakim Soria isn't one of the top 5 relievers in the AL
And and I laugh in your face
winning records follow good bullpens
How Is He
So different from every other pitcher with a similar skill set? I see him miss badly at times, but it’s never a fat pitch. Maybe that’s just luck. Mostly, he throws the ball where he wants to, and that will suffice most of the time.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
He hides the ball well.
Every report I have seen says that hitters don’t pick the ball up until it is on top of them. Plus it is hard for most guys to throw the curve when they are behind in the count but he locates it better than most.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
It's the little things SOria does
Hides the ball well, and it cuts – when you hide the ball, they see the ball for a shorter amount of time, which makes it look like you throw harder. So when he was throwing 92 tonight, he was getting swings and misses like he was throwing 96. Add in the cut, and suddenly he’s a lot more effective against lefties.
His slider has a lot of horizontal tilt, which is rare from a righty and his changeup arm action is superb. Mix in a curveball at 2 different speeds (both with a lot of late and large vertical action), superb command and you have Joakim Soria….
winning records follow good bullpens
In other news, we are tied for last with Detroit.
And, by the way, the AL Central sucks. We have one team above .500, the Twins, and they are only a half game above .500. And we might have the best pitching in the division. So hey, we might have a shot . . . and monkeys might fly out of my butt.
We are an impact bat away from first place.
2 games back, and the other teams have flaws that would be fatal in other divisions. Lets’ just hope that if we are buyers at the deadline that we don’t try a Juan Gone type experiment.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
Except we have our own flaw
Our terrible offense, and that flaw has been fatal in our OWN division…
Wait, we just won…cut out the pessimistic outlook right now, mister!
I agree, if we’re still in the hunt (maybe within 5-7 games of a wildcard spot) at the trading deadline, it would be nice to pick up some pop for the middle of the order, but I’m not sure we have enough to offer. There’s so much young talent that I don’t want to see us lose. Our biggest bargaining chip at this point is probably Grudz and German, and I don’t see a way for us to flip either (or both) of them for an impact bat for this year.
by RoyalsFanInBillings on May 3, 2008 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe our offense will be better in the rest of the season than it was in April
There is a possibility that what happens in one month doesn’t determine how the team will be for the rest of the season.
I probably disagree with you.
by Scott McKinney on May 3, 2008 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions
NYRoyal many may disagree tih you
but as I am on here more and more I am finding that you are the voice of reason, or at least say what I am thinking more often than pretty much everyone else.
I think that we will get better offensively plus Hillman stated today that if Pena doesn’t start hitting w/in the next month he will be sitting.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
The two extremes are almost always wrong
The “we’re great, playoffs here we come” people are wrong. There are few of them and they come out of the woodwork everytime the Royals win a few games in a row. The “we suck, the offense is and always will be horrible, the pitching staff is a house of cards and Moore has no idea what he’s doing” people are wrong. They have knee-jerk overreactions to anything even slightly negative that happen. In fact, they sometimes have negative overreactions to good things that happen. “How could we only have scored 4 runs that inning?” Knee-jerk negative overreactions are very, very common here and among the Royals fan base. “We’ve been bad for a long time, so I have a right to expect the worst!” I guess that’s true, but it is a poor excuse for half-assed and inaccurate analysis. I do my best to accurately analyze this team. There’s good and there’s bad. Right now, there’s more good than bad in the pitching staff. Right now, there’s more bad than good in the lineup. But it is a 6-month season. So far, we’ve played 1 month. Some of the good things will turn bad and some of the bad things will turn good. Assuming the worst and always focusing on the negative is an odd choice for a fan to make. But it is a common one.
I probably disagree with you.
by Scott McKinney on May 4, 2008 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions
Looking forward if we are 5-7 games out in the wildcard hunt
we may be in first place by an equal number of games projecting out how good the AL east and west may be.
Proud father of a budding Royals fan.
I STOPPED WATCHING AN NOW WE WON
WHERE IS THE LOVE IN THIS?????????????
I’ll have the BOD up sometime tomorrow. I’m not in the right frame of mind to HTML.
Boyfriend of the Year 2008: It's gonna be big!
by loyal2theroyals on May 4, 2008 12:07 AM EDT reply actions
Never Stop Watching
Nothing good can come of it.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on May 4, 2008 1:28 AM EDT up reply actions
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