An Intervention for Ryan Lefebvre
This needs to be said, as an intervention of sorts to our dear friend Ryan Lefebvre. Ryan, sit down. You're with family here. We're all part of the Royals Kingdom. These are your friends. This is very important.
Now listen to me and listen well.
Tony Pena Jr. is not good.
He's not. He's not a good hitter. He's not even an adequate hitter. He's quite terrible. His glove isn't even that good. He'll make a flashy play now and then but overall he's probably not much better than average. Listen to me, I know you just got married and perhaps you are stressed and that affects your judgment. We all expect a bit of homerism in Royals broadcasts, and certainly most of us appreciate how you talk up Gil Meche's grittiness. But listen to me.
Tony Pena Jr. is not good.
He was never good in the minors. Last year, yes, he was passable. But even then he had absolutely no power and no ability to draw a walk. He went 244 consecutive plate appearances without a walk last year. That is awful. He can't even bunt well. Ryan, are you paying attention?
Tony Pena Jr. is not good.
Say it with me. I know you can. Listen, we've tolerated your talk of Tony for awhile now. When you mentioned that Aviles playing was good for Tony so he could clear his mind and focus on hitting again, we could ignore it. After all, you have three hours of airtime to fill, and a 40-50 team to talk about, so a silly statement or two can be excused.
But last Sunday was the last straw my friend. You had the audacity to make this comparison.
Tony Pena Jr.
First 256 games
.237 Batting Average
59 RBI
87 Runs
31 Doubles
8 Triples
Frank White
First 261 games
.235
59 RBI
82 Runs
22 Doubles
6 Triples
I'm not quite sure why you used 256 games for Pena and 261 for White. I guess because 261 games coincides with the end of the 1975 season for Frank. Did you know Baseball-Reference now allows you to see a player's career numbers through a certain number of games? Baseball-Reference.com. Yes, its a website. Look it up, its a lot of fun.
Anyway, there are more than a few things wrong with your comparison. First, Frank, despite being quite inept with the bat early in his career, still was able to hit for some modest power. He hit eight home runs in those first 261 games, seven more than Tony. Still, his slugging percentage was pretty similar to Tony's. You may think that makes the comparison valid. Not quite.
Frank, despite being a hacker, drew more walks than Tony. Almost twice as many - 33 to Tony's 17. Still, his on-base percentage was similar to Tony's. You may think that makes the comparison valid. Not quite.
For you see Ryan, and remember, you're with family here, in 1975, when Frank was playing his 261st game, the average American League team averaged 4.30 runs per game. Last year, the American League averaged 4.90 runs per game. That may not seem like a lot Ryan. But it is. In 1975, the Royals won 91 games. And they scored 706 runs. Last year, the Royals won 69 games. And they scored 710 runs.
In 1975, Toby Harrah was the only AL shortstop that reached double digits in home runs. Last year, six AL shortstops reached double digits. The average AL shortstop in 1975 hit .240/.296/.314. The average AL shortstop last year hit .269/.322/.391. Do you get what I'm saying Ryan? Teams today score more runs. It isn't 1975. Teams built on light hitting infielders who field well, with centerfielders who steal 80 bases a year with no power are gone, just like Astroturf, Morganna the Kissing Bandit and those ugly yellow Padres uniforms.
There is a new-fangled stat, and yes, I know you don't like new-fangled stat because they take away from the game and the grit and old school baseball men like Buddy Bell know better, but just bear with me. Its a stat that combines on-base percentage, and slugging percentage, two of the most important simple statistics we can use to judge a hitter. It then compares those stats to the rest of the league. And here's the great part - it also takes into account ballpark and era! So when we see that George Brett slugged .467 in 1978 and see that Jose Guillen is slugging .465 this year, we know that George's slugging percentage is much more impressive because he played in an era before Barry Bonds robbed us of our national innocence.
Anyway, this stat is called OPS+, and an OPS+ of 100 is considered league average. For his career, Tony Pena Jr. has posted an OPS+ of 49. For his first 261 games, Frank's OPS+ was 66. Now, 66 may not seem great - its not. But its adequate, especially in that offensive era, and with a player who is quite possibly one of the best defenders at his position in baseball history. 66 coincidentally, is what Tony Pena Jr. put up last year, which was passable.
But this year, his OPS+ is 1. That's not a misprint. One. Uno. Un. Ichi. There have only been three seasons in MLB history with an OPS+ of 1 or less for players with at least 200 plate appearances. Two were done by Bill Bergen. That's over 100 years of baseball , Ryan. Not even Neifi Perez was this bad.
Tony Pena Jr. is not good.
Furthermore Frank was 24 after his first 261 games. He was just a young kid, still getting better. Tony Pena Jr. is 27. He has entered his prime. He is not likely to get much better than what he is. Frank had room to improve - and he did. By the time he was Tony's age he was an All-Star. Still, you may think that Tony will improve. After all, Frank had his best years in his 30s. But it would be absurd to project the kind of improvement Frank had to Tony Pena Jr. What Frank did was an aberration, not the rule. That's why Frank was as great as he was. Not everyone has his kind of talent. To illustrate the absurdity of projecting this kind of career explosion on Pena, let's take a look at George Brett's first 146 games:
.270/.298/.348 2 HR 47 RBI
Here's a guy that was similar through 146 games:
.270/.290/.365 2 HR 41 RBI
Who is this mystery guy? Why its Tony Pena Jr.! Why compare Tony to Frank White when you could have compared him to George Brett! Shall we begin the Tony Pena Jr. Hall of Fame campaign now?
This also reveals a downward trend for Tony Pena Jr. After 146 games, he hits like George Brett. After 261 games he hits like Frank White. After 400 games, we should expect his numbers to match...Onix Concepcion?
Look, I apologize for the length of this intervention, but it is for your own good. Now look, we can overlook your ramblings on how many runs Ross Gload's glove saves, or how Joey Gathright's speed distracts the pitcher, or how awesome the Royals defense is because of their fielding percentage. But Tony Pena is not good. He's not likely to get better. He's one of the worst hitters in baseball, and his glove is not good enough to make up that deficit.
Tony Pena Jr. is not good.
To compare one of the worst hitters in MLB history to one of the greatest Royals in franchise history not just embarrasses Frank, but it embarrasses yourself. And we don't want you to embarrass yourself Ryan. Like I said, you're with friends.
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41 comments
Comments
Clap, Clap, Clap, Clap.
You deserve a standing ovation for that post Sir! TPJ is certainly not good and it’s time Ryan learns the harsh truth from his friends.
by djk royal on
Jul 9, 2008 10:29 AM EDT
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That argument is pretty hard to refute
I like Ryan, but he gets a little sanctimonious at times. He’s better on the radio, but the TV broadcast is better with him instead of Bob Davis.
by raefzilla on
Jul 9, 2008 11:20 AM EDT
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I really wish Split would call Ryan more on that sort of stuff
But then again, Split dedicated all of last year to defending the amount of playing time that Buddy Bell gave to Jason LaRue.
I shouldn’t be so surprised.
by DarthYoshi on
Jul 9, 2008 11:32 AM EDT
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You didn't use "I statements": "I feel that TPJ is not good," "When you say TPJ is the next Frank White, it makes me feel."
I rec’d it anyway.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on
Jul 9, 2008 12:11 PM EDT
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Tony Pena Jr for the Hall of Fame!!
All we gotta do is stack the vets committee with cronies. I’llbet Dayton Moore has a good list we can use!
Chaim Mattis Keller New York City's # 1 Royals fan!
by cmkeller on
Jul 9, 2008 1:01 PM EDT
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someone needed to say it...
well done retro.
rec’d
by gilmeche55 on
Jul 9, 2008 1:24 PM EDT
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best post I've read in a long time
I sure wish the Royals broadcasters (Denny excepted, I think he tells it like it is) would be more truthful about the team.
Shameless distortions make the organization look inept. Tell it like it is, and the audience might embrace you for your honesty.
by loyal2sdad on
Jul 9, 2008 1:44 PM EDT
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See my post on this same topic made two weeks ago
http://www.royalsreview.com/2008/6/23/557221/pro-tony-pena-media-bias
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on
Jul 9, 2008 1:50 PM EDT
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Ryan Lefebvre
Ryan Lefebvre is a very good play by play man. It’s too bad he’s a sad shill for the organization. So much so, that I’d rather see him just “graduate” to some other team.
by bfos7215 on
Jul 9, 2008 2:04 PM EDT
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lefebvre sucks....annoying as shit
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on
Jul 9, 2008 2:13 PM EDT
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I don't think he's a shill. I think he really believes TPJ is an ok SS.
Ryan has bragged numerous times about never reading Moneyball. I don’t recall Ryan ever saying anything that wasn’t baseball cliche. I’m sure he thought asking Butler to bunt was the right decision. He is definitely from the old school, and the old school says defense, particularly at SS, wins baseball games.
I don’t expect Ryan to start throwing OPS+ around during a broadcast, but it would be nice if he’d expand his baseball mind a little. He doesn’t have to read Moneyball, but he should at least read enough to understand that you can’t justify a starting SS hiting .150.
Just a little curiosity about the world outside of “good teams advance runners and get timely hitting” would be nice.
by hippdoghipp on
Jul 9, 2008 2:52 PM EDT
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he should recognize what really good defense looks like then...
it doesnt look like tony pena jr.
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on
Jul 9, 2008 3:01 PM EDT
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Don't insult Onix
Pena won’t be that good.
by Big Guy on
Jul 9, 2008 2:12 PM EDT
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wait... so if tpj good or is he not good?
where .500 might; but, probably won't, happen.
by blue bandwagon on
Jul 9, 2008 2:29 PM EDT
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Nice job
I’m obviously less familar with the Royal announcers than some, but Ryan has been rather pigheaded when it comes to Pena.
A mind without purpose will walk in dark places.
by NHZ on
Jul 9, 2008 2:37 PM EDT
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He hit eight home runs in those first 261 games, seven more than Tony.
...
.270/.290/.365 2 HR 41 RBI
Who is this mystery guy? Why its Tony Pena Jr.!
Does not compute.
by suzzer on
Jul 9, 2008 3:03 PM EDT
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Error, error
Tony hit four home runs in his first 261 games, don’t know how I messed that up that badly.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on
Jul 9, 2008 3:06 PM EDT
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We're all waiting to embrace Lefebvre....
(wait for it)
...if he’d only turn his life around like Josh Hamilton.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on
Jul 9, 2008 4:01 PM EDT
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So, NYRoyal
which one of us should put DF on probation for this comment? :p
A mind without purpose will walk in dark places.
by NHZ on
Jul 9, 2008 4:21 PM EDT
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I think he deserves a suspension
...from 3-5 minutes (you choose). I’ll let you do the honors.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on
Jul 9, 2008 4:25 PM EDT
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I'm not on suspension, I just pulled both my typing groins!
And I don’t care what the fans think about it!
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on
Jul 9, 2008 4:33 PM EDT
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That's inappropriate
[/sarc]
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on
Jul 9, 2008 4:15 PM EDT
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The age difference is the biggest problem with the comparison in my opinion, but there is a much bigger reason to intervene with Ryan. He’s picked up all of the worst habits from Denny, the silliness, the digressions, the willingness to beat a topic into the ground. I love Denny, but Ryan is killing me lately. Maybe its Splits obvious dislike of Ryan that’s made me notice it. At least once a game I hear him say something that makes me think, wow, he really doesn’t like Ryan at all does he.
by sfeldkamp on
Jul 9, 2008 4:28 PM EDT
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Yea
I was just starting to like Ryan last year, and this year he’s been increasingly annoying. He is openly disdainful of sabermetrics, and consistently cites old school conventional wisdom about bunting, stealing bases, clutch hitting with runners in scoring position being a repeatable skill, working pitchers hard, grit, team chemistry, and the like. I guess I wouldn’t mind so much except he just seems much smarmier and arrogant about it this year. I guess that’s why I rose to defend Milton Bradley – not so much because Milton is a stand up guy that deserve the benefit of the doubt, but because Ryan has been awfully smarmy this year, and that kinda got to me when he went after Milton.
Plus he keeps dishing out lame jokes like he’s auditioning to be a SportsCenter anchor. Someone along the way must’ve told him he was funny, or he thought he’d take the Joe Buck career path to success. And I enjoy good humor now and then in my broadcast. But his schtick has worn thin and detracts from the game.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on
Jul 9, 2008 4:33 PM EDT
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I find it interesting and odd that the most recommended post ever on this site is about a broadcaster
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on
Jul 9, 2008 5:05 PM EDT
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Outside of the obvious quality of the piece
I’d say it’s the genre (humor) and the fact that it stands out—there have been multiple posts that people have liked and have been popular both for the original posts and the discussions (the recent Hochever discussions are obvious here), but his is a departure. that, combined with Retro’s typically clear and clever writing make it stand out. I rec’d it, so this might be a rationalization, but, with apologies to Stephen A. Smith, EVERYTHING I REC IS IMPORTANT.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on
Jul 9, 2008 5:14 PM EDT
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I do want to make clear that I'm not criticizing the content or the writing
It was very well written. Hopefully the recs are more about that than about how much we care about broadcasters. A player that gets 1 PA in a season is more important to this team than any broadcaster. But I’m not saying we shouldn’t talk about broadcasters, the stadium and other things which aren’t exactly important to what goes on on the field.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on
Jul 9, 2008 5:17 PM EDT
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Its more about Pena than Lefebvre
Lefebvre is simply the vessel through which I can express my outrage at the suckitude of Tony Pena Jr.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on
Jul 9, 2008 5:18 PM EDT
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I know I'm too old for it
But I get really upset, emotionally and intellectually, nearly once a week at something I hear on a baseball broadcast. I let most of it go - the endless praise of little ball, the weird steroid comments about random players, the trusims, etc. - but every once in awhile I just break.
by royalsreview on
Jul 9, 2008 5:35 PM EDT
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You, sir
are helping prevent this post from reaching the holy grail of double-digit recs with your old-school fundamentalism!
Sarcasmâ„¢. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on
Jul 9, 2008 5:44 PM EDT
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I'm not really criticizing the rec's, per se
But if I were to do so, it would definitely push the recs into double digits. Guaranteed. I have “fans”.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on
Jul 9, 2008 5:46 PM EDT
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It should also be pointed out
That some of the best written stuff on this site has little to do with the Royals players, for example the “Battle for…” series and the radio affiliate series.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on
Jul 10, 2008 10:52 AM EDT
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Well, I obviously recommend this post
However, in all fairness….I haven’t witnessed Ryan and his defiancy toward statistics and the modern era of baseball thinking, which perhaps correlates with not only his tolerance, but advocation, of the very presence of Tony Pena, Jr., on too many occasion (how’s that for a sentence?) Between work and coaching for a 6th grade baseball team, I have found watching Royals games few and far between (although I have listened to many games on the radio in my car and have witnessed about 10 games in person this season).
This post reminds me of that Paul Splittorff rant by HenKarvey from last year, which I RR’ed (retrospect recommended)!
by Royals Nation on
Jul 10, 2008 10:20 AM EDT
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I couldn't take it anymore.
Max, you may have seen JoePo’s post today where he discusses the need to sit down and “have a talk with his friend Ryan” about his whining about the umpires last night. That was just too much bait for me, so I asked him to take part in the intervention in re: TPJ, too.
Sarcasmâ„¢. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on
Jul 10, 2008 8:48 PM EDT
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Congrats, Retro.
It appears you’ve set a record for most recommendations.
A mind without purpose will walk in dark places.
by NHZ on
Jul 11, 2008 3:48 PM EDT
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Does this mean
I get the job?
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on
Jul 11, 2008 5:05 PM EDT
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