Game 119 Open Thread - Royals (54-64) at White Sox (65-52)
by Freneau on Aug 12, 2008 7:30 PM EDT
in Events
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PrintKansas City Royals at Chicago White Sox, Aug 12, 2008 8:11 PM EDT
Tonight's pitching matchup is Brian Bannister (5.37 ERA) versus Javy Vazquez (4.74 ERA).
After two months of pain that saw his ERA climb to 5.49, Bannister has semi-rebounded in his last three starts, posting a 4.40 ERA in his last 14.1 IP.
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Nope, sorry
The ode to the talented Jason Smith – today’s #9 hitter and HR hitter extraordinaire was first.
M Aviles SS 0 0 0 0 0 0 .335
M Teahen RF 0 0 0 0 0 0 .252
D DeJesus CF 0 0 0 0 0 0 .297
J Guillen LF 0 0 0 0 0 0 .258
B Butler DH 0 0 0 0 0 0 .270
A Gordon 3B 0 0 0 0 0 0 .258
R Gload 1B 0 0 0 0 0 0 .268
J Buck C 0 0 0 0 0 0 .230
J Smith 2B 0 0 0 0 0 0 .250
Totals 0 0 0 0 0 0
Thank Gload DDJ is back in the 3 Hole!
I use "Gload" as a verb or an adjective
Like “Gigli really Gloaded at the box office”, or “ugh, that new Weezer album is so Gload.”
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
Thanks to his beer goggles the man...
didn’t realize how gloady the chick he meet at the bar was.
I refuse to set up a signature....DAMMIT
In case everyone was wondering
The reason TPJ is not starting at DH is because Trey is saving him for some game heroics.
The 2 of you in your head?
or did you mean you and jsolo
16th!
If Banny hits someone with one of his off-speed pitches, will the batter even notice? or will he just think a mosquito bit him?
I refuse to set up a signature....DAMMIT
8th they grow irritated after they stop selling beer.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
The question is
do the Royals jump on the guys attacking Gload or do they let him get his ass kicked?
Orlando completed the cycle
a day late
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
ya they jumped all over Winston Salem 12-0 4th inning
Cegarra will cruise for the win.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Can we call him up already?
He’s wasting his time in Wilmington!!!
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
Paulo Now!
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow KC made Vasquez look like Greg Maddux, Roger Clemens and Pedro Martinez all rolled into
one that inning.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
no kidding
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:16 PM EDT up reply actions
banny seems to leave a lot of 0-2 pitches up
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:18 PM EDT reply actions
bannister needs to be sent down
how long can we be patient w/ this?
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:19 PM EDT reply actions
he definitely needs something to change but
I don’t see any reason not to let him finish the season.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions
He is a great pitcher his pereferials
say he is a #3 starter too bad our eyeballs say #6
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
I'd Settle For
That at this point.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:21 PM EDT up reply actions
UGH
Brian continues his dominance of the Sox
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
I'm Back From
A $50.00 drive to Homer. It was raining there!
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
What's that smell?
It’s either the South Side of Chicago or Banny. Take your pick
at least he didn't throw a lot of pitches...
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:21 PM EDT reply actions
Damn
besides the one mistake he looked like he had some decent stuff.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 8:21 PM EDT reply actions
the 0-2 pitch to cabrera was a mistake as well....shouldn't be able to pull line drives on 0-2
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Billy will get one of those 2 back this inning
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Is It Wrong
That I hate Neifi Perez a little more now?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
oh yeah
as much as i’m no longer a banny supporter…we ripped the mets in that deal
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Boston started a new knuckleballer today
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Pleeeease
not one of these games where we don’t hit anything, lord knows there have been too many this season.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 8:25 PM EDT reply actions
our lineup is one big out machine
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:25 PM EDT reply actions
the crazy thing is
I actually really like this lineup (excluding gload and smith).....it’s still early, though, they’ll break through next time through.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 8:26 PM EDT up reply actions
We Do Need
More Esteban, less Smith.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:27 PM EDT up reply actions
yes yes
he hits the Sox pretty well historically, I thought.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 8:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I Guess The
R/L matchup trumps talent and neutral splits.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions
testing dye's arm...usually a bad idea
but nice work alex
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:27 PM EDT reply actions
Nice Alex !!!
Gload is a lock for the RBI here
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Gload Now 9-21
Against Vasquez; it’s a wonder he’s not hitting 3rd.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions
every day w/o kila
means more ross gload….fuck.
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:29 PM EDT reply actions
not a home run?
he obviously needs to go get some work in AA…
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions
he swung at it like he swings at first pitches
poorly
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Missed It By
That much.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions
bannisters batting average agaist.. 290
Go Royals!
The Cell is crap
a lazy oppo-fly out goes to the warning track.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 8:32 PM EDT reply actions
Anyone know why they sent Brett Bigler all the way from A+
to Omaha?
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
he's strokin at High A .601 OPS I guess just to make room for Orlando
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Like Tomko?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions
that is very strange...
looks like he sucks on paper
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Plunk Swisher Now
Then send Gload into the stands in search of shirtless hillbillies to punch.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
not trying to be an ass
but it’s easier to do the old reply method, keeps things a lil more in order, and people always know what you’re talking about
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 8:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Buck
and yet during his 7 game hitting streak over that time, Teahen has caught a helluva lot more flack than Johnny Boy.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 8:40 PM EDT up reply actions
this offense makes me wanna get shitfaced
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:38 PM EDT reply actions
But His Peripherals
Are good.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:40 PM EDT up reply actions
wide zone tonight
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:40 PM EDT reply actions
+1
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:41 PM EDT up reply actions
c'mon mark
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:41 PM EDT reply actions
a one game slump
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:42 PM EDT up reply actions
but didnt't he go 0-6 in one game?
I wouldn’t exactly have called that a slump anyways.
I refuse to set up a signature....DAMMIT
Why Does He
Try to pull that pitch?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:44 PM EDT up reply actions
short answer
he’s a bad hitter
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 8:45 PM EDT up reply actions
He Hasn't Been
In the past; he’s missing 40-50 points of BA this year.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:49 PM EDT up reply actions
mmm, he has luke stuff tonight?
Go Royals!
I Haven't Seen
Anything over 91.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Paulo Orlando 2-4 with a 2b and HR tonite
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
He's Just A
Slap hitter with speed.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Banny Misses By
2 feet and K’s Pierzynski.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
Wow gameday called that 2nd pitch strike 1 looking, and then the ball on the exact same spot..
like i can no longer see the strike 2 pitch
Very Wide Zone
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Missed the pitcher with the bat
Go Royals!
Jesus
this zone is really wide, a nice pitch there but not a strike
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 8:56 PM EDT reply actions
+1
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions
ump has a show on he wants to watch later
Go Royals!
Water Polo Babes
Rule.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow
Bannister does look a whole lot better, really nice K pitch there.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 9:03 PM EDT reply actions
The Hitters Seem
To know the zone is a double-wide tonight. Konerko was really fishing out there.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
Is the biggest celebrity in the world ready to help your ball team?
Barack Obama is not adequate at sacrifice bunting. He once hit a home run and looked at it too long. He insists on playing left field when he could handle the left side of the infield.
John McCain, he’s ready.. for ANYTHING.. just like a ninja. John McCain doesn’t sleep, he waits!
The Manchurian Candidate
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:07 PM EDT up reply actions
this ump is ridiculous
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:07 PM EDT reply actions
Who flinches first Banni or Vasquez
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
I think banny already flinched...
or maybe I’m reading the score wrong
I refuse to set up a signature....DAMMIT
well ya there is that but I mean who gives up the next run
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
The 13th Inning
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Saving them for the next 2 games in the series
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Wow
at least the ump is bad for both teams.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 9:15 PM EDT reply actions
yeah, i'd be pissed if i were ramirez
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:17 PM EDT up reply actions
The Only Two
Batters Bannister has not retired scored. That’s what hitters with more than 20 HR’s do for you.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
Overrated speed is the wave of the future
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
shit
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:17 PM EDT reply actions
somehow i knew he would flinch first
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Holy crap...gamecast has that ball going as far as possible...
How long was it?!?
I refuse to set up a signature....DAMMIT
eh, probably 410ish
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:19 PM EDT up reply actions
I Don't Know
But it at least was a solo.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:19 PM EDT up reply actions
The HP ump is Ron Kulpa
Who was the HP ump for the 7/8 game, And I think he fucked something up then.
But Bill Hohn was the real moron in that crew.
ron...mea kulpa
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:20 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, we were ripping him pretty good
plus he’s from st louis, so he’s got that working against him
by Fernando Vina School of Linguistics on Aug 12, 2008 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Shitty debut for Charlie Zink
C. Zink 4.1 IP, 11 hits, 8 runs, 1 walk, 1 K
But it beats Scott Feldman’s line
S. Feldman: 2.2 IP, 10 hits, 12 runs, 6 earned runs, 3 walks, 2 strikeouts, 2 HRs
just homer aviles
forget all this “wait for teabag to score me”
just got home, saw
the fifth inning: Is Banny looking better? I mean, I’ll take his performance tonight if he can get another inning done safely. He just looks like he’s challenging people more.
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:23 PM EDT reply actions
he does look ok.....but the strike zone is ginormous
so that may hinder your excitement
by Fernando Vina School of Linguistics on Aug 12, 2008 9:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I am
certainly more tempered on the “Banny: Pitching God” theory. Now I’m more expecting him to be a #4 starter. I’m just starting to think he’s getting some of his kinks out. Kind of like Greinke just needed to get his crazy out for a year. My theory is Banny just needed to get some of his overthinking out and just pitch. But I need to see more at this point. It just seems his pitches have a bit more zip than they used to.
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions
His Curve Has
More bite, especially when it breaks down out of the zone (an out pitch?).
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:29 PM EDT up reply actions
wait...
you mean pitchers need an out pitch? Banny isn’t just going to confuse the batter into missing?
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions
He's on a good pace 65 through 5
CG of only 117.
This is some surprising efficiency
I refuse to set up a signature....DAMMIT
I'm glad we got Vasquez's FREAKIN CY YOUNG game
he looks like a total stud tonight
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Wow
this game is going waaaaaaaay too quickly. 83 pitches for Vazquez.
A mind without purpose will walk in dark places.
T-Bag!
with the walk.
Whats harder hitting a HR in the cell or walking with this Strike zone?
I refuse to set up a signature....DAMMIT
Inside-The -Parkers
Don’t come easy here.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, option C
according to team management earlier in the season: getting a ball past Tony Pena Jr.
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Alright
how the hell did that get out?
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 9:30 PM EDT reply actions
no kidding, they need to build a big league park there...that was a pop up
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:34 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd Slug Pierzynski
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Successful outing in Banni's eyes those HR's are just luck
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
ya it has nothing to do with them being total fatties down the pipe
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
4 hits and no walks for 4 runs is a bit unlucky.
6K, too… that’s not too bad an outing.
Swisher's Was A
HR in Yellowstone Park, but the other two were just fly balls in a major league park.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I didn't see AJ's but the other two were bombs on bad pitches
both mid to inner third you give any ml hitter those pitches and they will deposit them over the fence.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
I know this is probably silly
but I just don’t fear Jim Thome like I used to. Now I don’t worry about him.
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:33 PM EDT reply actions
Omaha must be getting ready for the September call ups
1 pitcher has went past 3 innings in the last 4 games
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Two Safeties?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:36 PM EDT up reply actions
JoGui
proves he’s a team player: Does not hit a selfish home run.
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:36 PM EDT reply actions
TPJ PR For
Hoagie? It worked well last time.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions
I was thinking more
TPJ PH for JoGui next time… he’s proven to be a good hitter when we needed him…..... BWAHAHAAHAHA…. .hahahaha…. /giggle
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:39 PM EDT up reply actions
CFL Rules?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:44 PM EDT up reply actions
um, ball 1 outside?
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:38 PM EDT reply actions
Gotta Be Swinging
Tonight.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions
w/ the king of slumps batting?
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions
HR Swing Produces
A bad bunt.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Lumsden on his way back
2.1 5 R 4 ER
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Lumsden Now!
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions
damn
just when he was starting to pitch better too.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow maybe we need to rethink that 40 man roster
Olivo
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
sweet what quarter are they in?
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
woo
Money Mike sweet little double play barehanded there.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 9:49 PM EDT reply actions
Hello
My name is Mike Aviles. I am a badass motherfucker.
“Hello, Mike”
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:49 PM EDT reply actions
Michigan?
I can see that state sucks, but…. /snark
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes, Michigan Sucks
And it’s ours.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Finally
we take back some territory from Detroit….. and Milwaukee…. and Chicago (Lake Michigan?), I guess.
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Nice Addition To
Our reservoirs, no?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions
ya i spoke to early on lumsden
7 R 6 ER
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
2 Out Walks
Are almost as good as leadoff walks.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
and the road goes ever ever on..
Texas leads off with a double
Go Royals!
john buck CANNOT throw
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:53 PM EDT reply actions
7 k's, 2 bb....not bad banny
keep it in the yard next time
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:54 PM EDT reply actions
+1
at the K I’m thinking it’s 3-0
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions
1-0...dye's wouldn't have gone out in center
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions
umm....
Banny: 7 IP, 7K, 1BB, 4 ER…
I’ll take that most days.
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:54 PM EDT reply actions
He didn't
fall apart… he gave up a few deep balls, but I’ll generally take a start like this. I mean, he’s a #4 starter or even #3… I’m ok with it. It’s not brilliant, but it’s perfectly acceptable.
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 9:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Too bad
Not an amazing start by Banny but damn good compared to what he’s done recently…just sucks our offense hasn’t mustered anything to make it a close game.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 12, 2008 9:54 PM EDT reply actions
Smitty guaranteed for meaningless hr tonight
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
Patience, Grasshopper
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 9:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Teahen Finally Gets
A pitch to pull and pulls it….......on the ground. Baby steps.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 12, 2008 10:00 PM EDT reply actions
my god
Never giving up on your team is what makes you a good fan.
by kcisbetterthanstlateverything on Aug 12, 2008 10:01 PM EDT up reply actions
royal reactions
Gload = groan
Teahen = confused, disappointed sigh
Aviles = smile
Greinke = raised eyebrow
Meche = appreciative nod
Soria = laugh following sickening curveball dropping from chest to ground.
by powderbluepower on Aug 12, 2008 10:01 PM EDT reply actions
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