What do we do with Guillen?
At this point, seriously, what CAN we do?
After the 'incident' last night where he reportedly 'went after' a fan, what options are there for GMDM & the organization.
There are conflicting reports as to the behavior of the fan in question. Supposedly Kevin Kietzman has spoken to SEVERAL fans that were near the incident, and he has received several statements from those fans that the fan that Jose 'went after' was not cursing, not making person attacks on either Jose or his family. The fan in question said in an interview with KK that the comment that set Guillen off was, "I got a 14 year old daughter that can run faster to 1st than you can."
He said he was sitting right near the tarp on the 1st base line, and Jose got all the way to the tarp, cussing him up & down, grabbing his crotch, etc.. At that point, the police officer there told the fan he had to go. According to the fan, he never stood up, never cursed (he said there were several kids around)
Look, it doesn't matter. Short of throwing a battery at Jose, it doesn't matter what the hell the fan said, it wouldn't condone Hoagies actions.
What are our options?
1) Keep him on the roster, placate to him like we have done to this point, and deal with the PR nightmare that comes along with it?
2) Outright release him, and eat the $30 million or so that is on his contract (possibly less, if someone picks him up for the veteran minimun, we won't be responsible for that amount.
3) Attempt to trade him. This is probably the option that will be explored, but a) what are we going to be able to get and b) how much $$ would we have to eat.
1 recs |
113 comments
Comments
I make JoGui take anger management classes and work one on one with a psychologist. Maybe that can help. Okay JoGui, count to ten.
Don't forget to send your broken maples to the US Forest Service.
by 306008 on Aug 27, 2008 3:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
TRADE HIS ASS
In the Royals game of life, Neifi Perez is the rake.
by Matty486 on Aug 27, 2008 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
After the 'incident' last night where he reportedly 'went after' a fan, what options are there for GMDM & the organization.
Are you implying that last night’s incident changes anything? Do you think that little silly incident means the Royals should have more reason to trade him or that it has made his trade value go down? Sure it was stupid for Guillen to “go after” a fan. But he didn’t touch him. End of story.
1) Keep him on the roster, placate to him like we have done to this point, and deal with the PR nightmare that comes along with it?
PR nightmare? What is the PR nightmare? In a day or two, this incident will be forgotten. Who gives a shit?
2) Outright release him, and eat the $30 million or so that is on his contract (possibly less, if someone picks him up for the veteran minimun, we won’t be responsible for that amount.
Why on earth would the Royals consider this? Because of this minor incident? Overreact much? Am I missing something here? This incident is something which will get a lot of play on talk radio and the blogosphere for one day. And that’s about it.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 3:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Are you serious?
Why do you choose to believe that I implied anything, let alone thta I implied #2?
I was posing a question.
My personal answer is that the fans of KC have to share in some of the blame in his meltdown.
Everybody knows that the guy has issues, and a lot of people, with Ketizman heading the charge, have made the decision to “poke the bear with a stick”. Nobody seems to believe it is possible that the guy is hurt, and doing what he can. Everybody pissed & moaned when Sweeney would go on the DL with a back injury, and new we get a guy that could potentially be playing through a fair degree of pain, and the collective fan base turns on him in a heartbeat, just because of his ‘reputation’. The manager has come out and said that he told Jose to ‘do what he could’ when he was fighting whatever issues he had with his legs. If that means jogging to first on what 99% of the time is a routine play, then that is what Jose did. If that means not moving toward a fly ball to the gap when the fastest guy on the team is closer to it, and can get o it, thats what he did.
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And to answer your question
as to ‘why they would even consider’ outrighting him…
If GMDM does choose to trade him, he’s going to have to eat a LOT of money, and probably not get anything back in return that is every going to make a significant contribution to the organization. For arguments sake, I’ll assume that we’d eat 1/2 the contract.
It would have to be a consideration for the organization to weigh the PR value in outrighting him vs that $15 or so million difference in trading him. Weather you agree or not, people in KC (not a vast majority, but a growing few) are fed up. GMDM’s reputation among the casual fans is taking a hit b/c they don’t understand anything (1/2 the calls to talk radio say to send him down or suspend him w/o pay, 2 things that w know aren’t really possible).
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If GMDM does choose to trade him, he’s going to have to eat a LOT of money
You have no idea if this is true. I don’t think it is.
For arguments sake, I’ll assume that we’d eat 1/2 the contract
I don’t buy that argument, but ok.
It would have to be a consideration for the organization to weigh the PR value in outrighting him vs that $15 or so million difference in trading him. Weather you agree or not, people in KC (not a vast majority, but a growing few) are fed up. GMDM’s reputation among the casual fans is taking a hit b/c they don’t understand anything (1/2 the calls to talk radio say to send him down or suspend him w/o pay, 2 things that w know aren’t really possible).
So you’re saying that the Royals might consider just releasing him rather than trading him because the PR value of a release is worth more than the PR value of trading him? If you are right that the fans hate Guillen and want him gone, then DM would be pleasing them by trading him, wouldn’t they? Wouldn’t it make sense to trade him and save half of the money in his remaining contract than just releasing him? #2 isn’t a consideration. There’s no logical reason to do it or even think about it.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
32 Year old OF's
in the first year of a 3yr/12mil contract who have an 84 OPS+. Hmm, I would assume we would eat somewhere near half of his last two years to make something happen.
Put simply, is this year’s production from Guillen an aberration? Given his age and 99 career OPS+ I don’t think so.
Yes, I’d trade him and eat a bunch of contract and HOPEFULLY get something young and promising in return. Guillen is a prime time fucking asshole and he fucking sucks at baseball these days too. Can his ass.
Alex Gordon in '08
by RoyalJHWKR on Aug 27, 2008 8:29 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
People were trying to get him right before the deadline
when he was already slumping again, so teams are interested. I don’t think the Royals would have to eat the whole thing. I don’t know, it is all rumors, but I got the feeling that the Royals wouldn’t necessarily have to eat much of the money. Getting the contract off of the books for a PTBNL would really give the Royals some freedom going into free agent signing. That’s how I see it, anyway.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 27, 2008 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Guillen is a prime time fucking asshole and he fucking sucks
It’s kind of hard to take your analysis seriously when you say stuff like this.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 11:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well
it DOES have the cachet of not being entirely inaccurate. :x
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 28, 2008 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Perhaps
But when a sentence referring to a player includes “asshole” once and “fucking” twice, I think it comes more from the heart than the head.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 28, 2008 12:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you joking?
You need to get your blinders off Guillen is definitely an asshole. I don’t care what he does around his family the way he treats the fans/teammates/coaches is a direct reflection of his character. I don’t say trade him but he is definitely a asshole.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 28, 2008 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, he's an asshole
But I still say when the guy calls him a “fucking asshole” who “fucking sucks” then he’s not giving sound, level-headed analysis. He’s cranky because Guillen isn’t a nice guy and hasn’t played well enough this year so he’s lashing out. More heart than head, period.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 28, 2008 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
-1 on blaming the fans for Guillen's antics.
by djk royal on Aug 27, 2008 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Was that fan at all responsible for Guillen's response?
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not really.
Fans heckle and cross lines. It happens. Many are ignorant and drunk. In no way does that mean a player should attempt to jump into the stands to go after them. Not appropriate.
by djk royal on Aug 27, 2008 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Please do not misinterpret that I am condoning Jose’s attempt to go after a fan, it doesn’t matter what he did/didn’t say, that part is not ok
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hear your point about playing through injuries.
I just think Guillen is a jerk and I don’t blame the fans for booing him. He is hard to like for a multitude of reasons.
by djk royal on Aug 27, 2008 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The only time
I personally think it is really ‘OK’ to boo/heckle someone is when it is obvious they aren’t trying to succeed. He has had flashes of that this year, but as I stated earlier, we don’t know if Trey told him to take it easy to save his legs at spots, as Trey has reported.
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess I see a lot of not hustling.
Maybe it is due to injury but IMHO it isn’t.
by djk royal on Aug 27, 2008 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fans heckle and cross lines. It happens. Many are ignorant and drunk. In no way does that mean a player should attempt to jump into the stands to go after them. Not appropriate.
Agreed completely. I also think that when fans say certain things they are partially responsible. Is what Guillen did or tried to do ok? Definitely not. Is the fan partially responsible. Definitely.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
holy crap
that is far & away the closest you’ve ever came to agreeing with something I’ve typed on this site! (except for the time we agreed to disagree)

by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm sure I've agreed with you many times
I just often don’t (+1) or say “I agree” with posts that I agree with. Most go uncommented upon. There’s more to discuss when I don’t agree.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well
thats what I meant (geez, you even disagree with me on when we agree)

by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting coincidence...
that there is a suspect looking medicine bottle with the phrases “maximize gains” and “rest and recover” on a Jose Guillen thread.
by djk royal on Aug 27, 2008 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was just trying to clarify
Lots of people think I have it out for them because I disagree with them a lot. I reality, I disagree with everyone a lot, and I keep most of my agreement to myself, unless I think I have something to add.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Learn To Be
Irrational.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 27, 2008 7:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know
It is a very unpopular opinion and one that I am not really proud of.
I keep coming back to Alberto Callaspo. He did something that a LOT of people would argue is a hell of a lot worse than anything jose has done this year, and we haven’t heard boo about it in the media or from fans simply because he isn’t making $13 million.
Keitzman put a big fat target on Jose Guillens back as opposed to taking a more laid back approach and saying this guy is going to do crazy things, but when he’s healthy he should produce, he started a witch hunt among the large and vocal 810 fan base.
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It just kind of sucks
That Jose is doing exactly what we got on Sweney for Not doing, and playing through injuries, and he probably hears worse things than even Sweeney did.
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Moore doesn't care about Keitzman or anything he says on his silly little radio show
Neither Moore, nor just about any other GM is going to make a player personnel decision based on radio talk show host blather or fan opinion.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
do you really think i am that stupid?
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think you are stupid at all
I just think that fan opinion of Guillen, which may become ever worse because of the things some talk show host is saying, won’t affect Moore’s player personnel moves one bit.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why do you choose to believe that I implied anything, let alone thta I implied #2?
I thought you were implying this because you chose to create a fanpost saying “what should we do with Guillen now that this incident has happened?” Doesn’t that imply that this incident has somehow changed things? If not, why create the fanpost?
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This incident
added to it in the eyes of the general fan base
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cool
Who cares how the fan base feels about Guillen? Do you think Moore is going to make player personnel moves based on how the fans feel?
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If
the few fans that still do buy tickest stop buying them, he might be forced to
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So you think Moore might react to lower attendance by dumping Guillen?
You think that Moore might interpret decreased attendance as fans being upset at Guillen? I think that’s silly. Moore knows that all fans really care about is wins and losses. So Moore is trying to get more wins and fewer losses. Therefore, he’ll make the player personnel decisions which are most likely to get more wins and fewer losses. He’s not going to unload a player based on fan opinion of that player.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
not at all
But I think if the marketing/merchandising department receives a large spike in calls saying they wont come back, yadayadayada, then Dan Glass will hear about it. Since Dan Glass cares about $$ you don;t think he might just pull DM to the side & say get rid of this guy?
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think
that in the extreme case of a mass of season-ticket holders explicitly informing the club “I will not renew as long as this player is still here,” a GM would definitely consider acceding to the pressure.
But that’s a very extreme case, and relies on a direct correlation. If it’s just fans raising hell on talk radio, then of course the GM will ignore it.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 27, 2008 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Has that ever happened?
mass of season-ticket holders explicitly informing the club "I will not renew as long as this player is still here,"
I’m not disagreeing with you here. But isn’t this not only extremely unlikely, but isn’t it true that this has never happened in the history of baseball? I’m not aware of it ever happening in the history of professional sports.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That would be why I
used the word “extreme” and even emphasized it, sir.
I have heard reports of it happening on a small scale, but never enough to cause a club to concern itself.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 27, 2008 6:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's what I thought
That would be why I used the word "extreme" and even emphasized it, sir.
And I did make a point of saying that I wasn’t disagreeing with you. I was just extending your comments to point out how extremely unlikely and unprecedented such an occurrence would be.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 27, 2008 6:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Did they even do that after the Brett Myers incident?
Especially since the club, everyone (with possible exceptions in Alberto Callaspo and Bobby Cox) would agree, mishandled it so badly?
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 27, 2008 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
they=season ticket holders
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 27, 2008 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I will argue against myself for a moment...
The Chiefs fans non-renewal of their season tickets en mass hasn’t gotten rid of King Carl
by GoBabies!! on Aug 27, 2008 9:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Would teams looking at Barry Bonds
this past offseason count? Surely some team thought he could be useful.
by Top Ramen on Aug 28, 2008 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even if Guillen had been an angel this year
I would still say, based on his performance, etc. the Royals should try to trade him for the best offer that includes taking on his whole salary.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 27, 2008 3:53 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yes
I’d even be willing to swallow a little money, or take on someone else’s albatross (like Austin Kearns)
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Aug 27, 2008 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Depends on what else the Royals are getting back
Assuming it’s nothing or close to it, I would want them to take on enough money to get at least a second-tier FA — a Hinske or Rivera (not necessarily someone like that, but someone in that class). I don’t know how much they’ll get. I’d want the other guys to take no more than half, though, if the Royals are getting nothing (e.g., TPJ II, Gload), in return.
Is he old enough to be a Dodger yet?
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 27, 2008 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like Kearns
but he’s sort of become the Mark Teahen of DC
This space intentionally left blank.
by marbotty on Aug 28, 2008 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I liked Kearns a lot when he was a Red,
but the last two years have been very bad to him. I haven’t seen him play during that time so I have no insight as to what went wrong, but he is having a horrible year in 2008. At this point I would only take Kearns on a minor league deal. I am not at all sure he will give more next year than Maier/Costa/Gathright.
www.rockchalktalk.com for pretty good KU baseball coverage
by James Quinn on Aug 30, 2008 5:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Incident
The incident is important only in that it is one more straw against Guillen working out in KC. I am not sure how many more straws its going to take, but you have to think that it isn’t many more.
Go Royals!
by BabyBlues on Aug 27, 2008 3:58 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The facts:
1. Jose is a jerk to his teammates, to the fans and to the coaching staff.
2. Jose is bad at baseball offensively, defensively and on the basepaths.
3. Jose is still owed about $28 million for the next two plus years.
As much as the first issue is a problem the second and third ones are much bigger problems.
by djk royal on Aug 27, 2008 3:59 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Hang on
Which teammates have asserted that Jose is a jerk to them? For that matter, outside of a run-of-the-mill clubhouse disagreement with McClure, what evidence do we have that he’s a jerk to the coaching staff?
Seriously, I think anyone who puts any weight at all on this stuff in the absence of reports of serious conflicts has, you know, never had a job, where real human beings grouse about their lazy-ass coworkers and bitch about their bosses every day. And before someone belches up something like “But that’s a dream job, they should suck it up” needs to understand that even dream jobs have rough spots, and people still bitch.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 27, 2008 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Viktor Frankl Made
The most profound statement on the relativity of happiness and sadness that I have ever read. People will find reasons for both, regardless of their conditions.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 27, 2008 7:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
what serendipity
I was actually thinking of Frankl (and Eleanor Roosevelt) when it was implied that the fans were somehow responsible for Guillen’s actions…
This space intentionally left blank.
by marbotty on Aug 28, 2008 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So your saying that anyone who thinks Jose Guillen is a jerk...
to his teammates and coaches has never had a job? That makes loads of sense. Great analogy. If you listened to talk radio around KC you would know that Hillman and McClure have no idea what to do with Jose and their relationship is tenuous at best.. If you listened to player interviews, which I have, with Teahen and Butler they are careful not to say anything terrible about him but make it clear that he gets a special set of rules and they just have to shrug it off and let Jose be Jose. Not only that but look at the guys history where, if memory serves me correctly, he was kicked off the team weeks before the playoffs for threatening his manager. Never mind, the endless string of teams he’s worn his welcome out on. It is not exactly a leap of logic to think Jose Guillen is not a great employee and manager.
by djk royal on Aug 28, 2008 9:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Listening to KC talk radio
does not give you anymore insight than anyone else, especially if its KK you’re talking about.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 28, 2008 12:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
To just dismiss an entire medium of information as irrelevant
and incapable of adding any insight is not really a good way to gain “insight”. I think Everyone realizes that talk radio needs to be taken with a grain of salt. That doesn’t mean that it is absolutely useless.
by djk royal on Aug 28, 2008 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just MOSTLY useless?
A mind without purpose will walk in dark places.
by NHZ on Aug 28, 2008 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It has its uses. Personally, I like Soren Petro a lot.
He has a good show and yes you can actually gain insight (gasp!!!).
by djk royal on Aug 28, 2008 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yea
Soren Petro is truly a great Radio man. He stayes in the center of nearly every issue like this, seeing the argument for both sides of the coin.
by GoBabies!! on Aug 28, 2008 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
talk radio is not useless, and I never said that it was. I love Soren Petro’s show, that being said, I don’t believe listening to talk radio where they try to fill the show by stirring people up into a mess provides any more insight to issues than any other kind of medium. I also like the morning shows on 810 too, especially bukaty and st. john.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 28, 2008 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There's a reason I don't listen to talk radio.
For instance, Kevin Keitzman, possibly the least brilliant graduate of my former high school.
You evaded my point: which teammates have asserted that Jose is a jerk to them? NONE. Even your attempt to try and justify your comment with “interviews… with Teahen and Butler” doesn’t support your claim. Indeed, there’s a difference between “a different set of rules/Jose Being Jose” and “being a jerk to one’s teammates.”
Again, allow me to re-enter the world where real people have jobs; imagine a guy who gets to work from home two days a week while you have to go to the office. You just basically tried to argue that this makes him a jerk, when in fact he may be perfectly nice to his co-workers when he’s around.
I haven’t heard about any Jose vs. Teammate fistfights. I haven’t heard anyone talking under the radar that Jose’s berating his teammates in the clubhouse. You have nothing, nothing at ALL, to base your statement on, and the fact that you’re even trying to defend it after being called out on it is laughable.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 29, 2008 4:41 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
There was one story,
about Alex Gordon showing some aggrivation at Guillen in the dugout one game. Gordon apparently was telling Guillen to not get into a fight with a fan and Guillen started cursing at Gordon. At that point Gordon walked away showing some aggrivation.
I don’t know how much public information is out there about Guillen’s clubhouse popularity in KC but there is plenty out there about how he was seen by teammates in past years. Let’s just say many former teammates of Guillen are a bit cool towards him.
www.rockchalktalk.com for pretty good KU baseball coverage
by James Quinn on Aug 30, 2008 5:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gordon obviously doesn't know what it takes to be a major leaguer!!111
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 30, 2008 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Guillen is already at 80 RBIs
Do we really want to return to the days of the team-leading total being in the 60s?
The only Royal I have ever booed was Mike Wood. Guillen does not deserve the wrath of Royals fans.
by jbrocato on Aug 27, 2008 10:18 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
why did you boo mike wood?
Don't forget to send your broken maples to the US Forest Service.
by 306008 on Aug 27, 2008 11:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That someone cared enough about Mike Wood
to boo him is the even bigger mystery.
Sometimes you just gotta roll the potato.
by CentralChamps2009 on Aug 28, 2008 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
If you had seen him pitch in St. Louis in 2006...
You would have booed too, especially considering what the Royals gave up for him.
by jbrocato on Aug 28, 2008 8:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Royals
didn’t give up shit for him. He was a throw in basically
by GoBabies!! on Aug 28, 2008 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mike Wood's two years with the Royals
Were comparable to Brian Bannister’s. Other than Mike Wood’s zombie like appearance, the two actually have a lot in common. We didn’t give up shit to get either of them, for one.
Banny being Banny.
by JobDDT on Aug 28, 2008 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would disagree with that
I’m not even going to look at the numbers, but many of Wood’s appearances were in relief and were mediocre to my recolection. So I would much rather take a good season from a starter and then a digression in the next season (Bannister) than a crappy middle reliever/spot starter (Wood).
by I need more Esteban on Aug 28, 2008 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't boo Guillen
but getting 80 RBIs when while playing every day (even when he should probably be resting his strained groins) and hitting 4th behind the teams best OBP guys (not himself, but Gordon [for the first half], DeJesus, and Aviles isn’t all that amazing. Hell, Tony Batista had 110 RBIs for Montreal in 2004. Although at this point even worse (but just barely) adjusted rate stats than Emil Guillen.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 27, 2008 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
No matter what they decide about Guillen the real embarassment in the whole situation is Hillman
I don’t care if you were in the toilet or not that should never be an excuse for anything. Make something else up for gods sake.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 28, 2008 10:53 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
You guys know I think Guillen is an idiot
but I don’t think any situation has been created here that demands an immediate solution. I wouldn’t have a problem with Guillen being on this team next year if he’s able to bounce back, even if I still won’t think he’s a nice guy.
A mind without purpose will walk in dark places.
by NHZ on Aug 28, 2008 11:08 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree
The afore mentioned ‘talk radio’ voices have repeatedly said things like, “too far” and “How did it get this bad” when referring to Jose. Really? What has he done that is irreperable? Absolutely nothing (expect possibly his relationship w/ McClure, but we’ll a) never the the details on what happened, and b) who gives a shit of a P coach doesn’t get along w/ an OF’er?)
I can’t really blame the media in KC. It’s been so long since they;ve had a reason to talk about the Royals in August they are just milking it for all its (not) worth. You should hear how they are blabbering on & on endlessly about the Chiefs fucking KICKING situation?!?!?!? Like that matters! Ooh, if they pick the wrong kicker they may only get 4 wins instead of 5, so liets overanalyze this for hours on end!!!
Anyway, I think the situation will kind if “go away” if certain things are done in the offseason. As much as I’ve been villafied for my objection of Dunn/Burrell, adding a bat like that to hit behind JOGUI would probably settle him and the fans down quite a bit b/c Jose wouldn’t be the ‘only’ guy at that point (the same effect could be had by Butler/Gordon taking a drastic step forward next season).
by GoBabies!! on Aug 28, 2008 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I still doubt it
but just for the record, any of those guys (with the possible exception of Butler, if he doesn’t outhit Guillen next year, which I think he might) should be hitting ahead of Guillen because they can actually get on base. I know lineup order doesn’t make that much of a difference, but it does more than “protection.”
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 28, 2008 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
For the record,
there’s really no hard evidence that shows “protection” in a lineup is a real factor.
A mind without purpose will walk in dark places.
by NHZ on Aug 28, 2008 7:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hence the quote marks,
“asshole”
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 28, 2008 9:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry, that wasn't supposed to
be a reply to you.
A mind without purpose will walk in dark places.
by NHZ on Aug 29, 2008 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
apology
“accepted”
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 29, 2008 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good thing this isn't a football blog.
Or you would get posterized for saying that the difference between a good kicker and a bad one is one win.
Banny being Banny.
by JobDDT on Aug 28, 2008 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Soren just opened his show
apologizing to Guillen and admitting that he went too far with his rant about Guillen yesterday. He got a few emails from others at the game that had different perspectives of what happened.
Apparently, yesterday, the guy who got kicked out was made to be a hero on the radio and was not criticized that much. Several people emailed Soren/Keitzman to tell them that the the guy was actually not being “just a fan”. He kept referring to Guillen as “boy” repeatedly. The man said he had to move his kids away from the seats because of what was going on and it was because of the guy. He said of course Guillen’s actions weren’t right, but that the fan should not be excused either.
Interesting stuff, doesn’t excuse Guillen, but still, the fans just riding him for hte fun of it is kind of annoying.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 28, 2008 12:36 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Interesting "INSIGHT" you gained from listening to talk radio.
by djk royal on Aug 28, 2008 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"insight" and "talk radio" shouldn't be used in the same sentence
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 28, 2008 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
haha c'mon man
I listen to talk radio just as much as anyone in the area. I’m just saying, you claimed that by listening to the radio shows around here that there is more to learn than those who don’t. It’s simply not true.
And it’s also funny that the issue I’m talking about has to do with a radio host (Soren, in this case) going too far on an issue and taking up an entire segment bashing Guillen when he didn’t have all the facts.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 28, 2008 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So you don't gain any knowledge from Soren?
I know it’s primarily for entertainment but he does have some inside connections and good guests that I not only enjoy listening too but actually gain some insight (I know there’s that word again) every now and again.
by djk royal on Aug 28, 2008 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does information equal insight?
Radio shows like his can occasionally provide some news an information, but that’s about it. Good analysis and insight? Not so much.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 28, 2008 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Boog Sciambi
There’s a dude I’d like the Royals to sign
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 28, 2008 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your absolutism and generalizations about everything you talk about make you look silly.
Banny being Banny.
by JobDDT on Aug 28, 2008 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your posts make you look silly
Are we even now?
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 28, 2008 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Have you listened to Petro?
He is not one of your typical sports radio shockjock types who wants to get the masses all crazy so their ratings improve. Petro is probably closer to all of us than he is the typical baseball fan. He looks at the game in a well rounded manner and isn’t afraid to admit when he is wrong about something. I think he offers alot of good info from a decently balanced platform as opposed to most radio jockeys. In fact I wouldn’t be shocked if he is a member of this site.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 28, 2008 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, I've listened to Petro
I know he’s not a sensationalistic shock jock. I also don’t think he provides particularly good analysis or insight. Just my opinion.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 28, 2008 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Alright
You keep stating that I’m saying all this stuff when I’m not.
I like Soren, he’s my favorite sportsradio guy in KC. He has great segments and I believe he knows a lot about sports.
But you said: “That makes loads of sense. Great analogy. If you listened to talk radio around KC you would know that Hillman and McClure have no idea what to do with Jose and their relationship is tenuous at best.”
I listen to KC talk radio, and there are no facts that that is true whatsoever. Oh maybe Kevin Keitzman spouted off to get everyone riled up by saying this. But Hillman has never come on and said anything about “not knowing what to do with Guillen”. Buuuuut, I have heard Kevin Keitzman say that:
“obviously Hilman has no control over Guillen or the team, blah blah blah blah, people please get riled up and call into my show so I can not listen to you and keep rambling about my point over and over without taking any other opinion in.” (That was Keitzman). Anyways, I listen to KC talk radio, I like Soren, I like segments from KK sometimes. I just think that your statement about Hillman and coaches having no control is KK propoganda.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 28, 2008 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't want to enter the Talk Radio debate, but
In today’s installment Franz Kafka’s Life of Brian (aka Banny Log), JoPo writes:
these days Trey seems barely recognizable to me. I went to see him for a week in Japan last October, and I saw a guy who was at ease with himself, who was confident but didn’t need to let everyone know it, who was comfortable with players even though they didn’t speak the same language, a guy who was so respectful of the game of baseball that it poured out of him, and you could imagine that if you played for him you would not want to let him down. That’s why I thought he was going to be a huge success as Royals manager. He still may. But I have to say that I have not seen that guy much in Kansas City. Instead, I’ve seen Trey be defensive and cold, I’ve seen him constantly trying to make himself seem like the smartest guy in the room, I’ve seen him turn off players by preaching at them, I’ve seen him overcompensate for his lack of big league experience (well, he had none coming in), I’ve seen him alienate people who want to like him for reasons I cannot understand, and I’ve seen him take it all too hard. I’ve chalked it all up to two things: First-year discomfort and the neck-pain of dealing with Jose Guillen. But it’s getting late. And it’s getting worse.
Now, Posnanski is far from infallible, but I wouldn’t characterize him as sensationalistic, He may misread things, but I think he probably has as much or more insight into what’s going on in the clubhouse than any other “outsider.” He paints a picture of a clubhouse in disarray. It’s mostly about Hillman, in that quote, but Guillen is singled out. I’m not saying this is the final word, or that it should influence how the Royals look at Guillen. If he was hitting 116 OPS+, I’d say who cares, we can put up with him. As above, if he was an angel hitting 92 OPS+ (and how I wish at least the 92 was the case), I’d still say dump his salary. Without reading into it, it definitely implies that Hoagy isn’t helping out much behind the scenes.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 28, 2008 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Very nice stuff, I too value what JoPo has to say.
I will still say, though, there could be many reasons why Hillman isn’t the guy that JoPo first saw. A big one could be the pitiful team that won’t do the things he is trying to preach/teach. Another issue could be Jose Guillen, another one could be his favorite dog sparky that lost it’s leg in a car accident (Humor). My point is that none of us know how much control Hillman has over Guillen and because we listen to talk radio or not will not tell us more or less than others.
by I need more Esteban on Aug 28, 2008 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here's my question:
Posnanski went to Japan to see Trey Hillman? WTF?
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 28, 2008 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't you remember when he did that series from Japan during their world series?
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 28, 2008 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No
I was preoccupied last fall
I’m sort of disappointed. I thought JoPo flew to Japan just to talk to the incoming Royals manager. The thought delights me. It would be like Lost in Translation, except with JoPo on the phone with his wife and daughters, giving sage and chaste relationship advice to Scarlett J. culled from Springsteen songs, and watching Indians games on satellite ESPN Classic.
Still sounds better than the actual movie.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 28, 2008 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the trip wouldn't have happened if it hadn't been for Hillman's hiring
While he “covered” their world series, I think it was really mostly about Hillman.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 28, 2008 6:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah I remember that
it was pretty good stuff
by I need more Esteban on Aug 28, 2008 7:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What can we do?
Throw batteries at him.
Banny being Banny.
by JobDDT on Aug 28, 2008 4:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It would be great for fans to cross the line even more
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 28, 2008 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wish I could find a picture of him with the Monsteromoeter or Frog Exaggerator
i
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 28, 2008 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

by 















