Hosmer sitting out due to Alvarez situation
by RoyalsRetro on Aug 29, 2008 1:54 PM EDT
104 comments
Troubling info. How troubling? Not sure yet.
Alvarez deadlock affects Hosmer, Royals
Royals Corner sources have confirmed that Hosmer did not dress for Thursday night’s game, and that it was indeed directly related to the situation with Alvarez and the Pirates. The organization is tight-lipped about the situation, and we still do not know whether Hosmer’s exclusion from the lineup came at the request of Boras, minor league baseball, or Hosmer himself, but we understand that he isn’t likely to suit up again until baseball resolves the impasse. At issue is the question of whether or not a contract signed after the midnight August 15 deadline is valid, even if, as in the case of both Hosmer’s and Alvarez’s negotiations, an extension was granted by the commissioner’s office.
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Is this the time to remind everyone that I hate Boras and his negotiating tactics?
Don't forget to send your broken maples to the US Forest Service.
by 306008 on Aug 29, 2008 2:15 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
If this is mandatory from the league or from Hosmer/Boras
then I hope his bonus/paycheck are being withheld. It’s not the kid’s fault, but unless the Royals are doing this of their own accord, they shouldn’t have to pay until Hosmer’s situation and relation to this is resolved in a way that he can continue playing.
One doesn’t need to rip Boras for anything to see how fucked up this is. Whether or not this is Alvarez’s fault, this is clearlly not what Hosmer wanted (unless we hear that it now is), since he signed. I just don’t see how that’s “good agenting,” and, like him or not, that’s not typical Boras style.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 29, 2008 2:18 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Boras cares more about his ego than anyone he represents.
by djk royal on Aug 29, 2008 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're not seriously suggesting
that Boras is in this for the money and prestige, are you?
A mind without purpose will walk in dark places.
by NHZ on Aug 29, 2008 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he doesn't get good outcomes for his clients
….then he won’t get or keep good clients, won’t make big money and won’t be able to feed his ego. He has become baseball agent #1 precisely because he has gotten the best monetary outcomes for his clients. The prestige, ego-fodder and money are all the result of him being extremely successful at getting big money for his clients, which is exactly what they want.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tell Matt Harrington about good outcomes.
No doubt he’s successful but his lust for every last dollar may have cost many players more in the long run by delaying their professional careers for a year. Varitek, Drew, Hocheaver all sat out one more year than necessary fighting over less than a million dollars. Not to mention the damage he may have done to the reputations of JD Drew and maybe Alvarez for example.
by djk royal on Aug 29, 2008 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
regardless of what Boras was telling him to do....
its pretty obvious that the harrington situation was on Harrington. He has the final say. He decided to turn down $4 million, then $1 million, etc. Moose went against Boras in the end…b/c he and his family realized the opportunity that he had been given.
He also made Alvarez (by going to Vandy turning down over a million) and Drew more money with his tactics. Notice, its 10 years and two extremely good JD Drew contracts later and Drew is still with him. He went FA after a down year, got a less than ideal contract, boras got him an opt out clause…and he was a FA again after like 3 years…after a good season and got a big 5 year deal. JD Drew’s reputation was so badly damaged that his top prospect brother also went with Boras.
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Aug 29, 2008 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Boras was not representing Harrington when he turned down his big initial draft signing bonus
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
even more of a reason why its not boras' fault
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Aug 29, 2008 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Matt Harrington was not represented by Boras when he turned down the big offer when he was first drafted
He was represented by Boras in later drafts.
No doubt he’s successful but his lust for every last dollar may have cost many players more in the long run by delaying their professional careers for a year.
I don’t think delaying a draftee’s career a year costs them money. One of the biggest reasons is that for the vast majority of draftees, the only big payday they get is their initial signing bonus/contract. So they should definitely work hard to make that as big as possible.
Varitek, Drew, Hocheaver all sat out one more year than necessary fighting over less than a million dollars.
It doesn’t appear to have hurt them economically. In fact, one could argue that it help them greatly. Certainly the huge amount of money those guys have made in their careers doesn’t exactly support your argument.
Not to mention the damage he may have done to the reputations of JD Drew and maybe Alvarez for example.
J.D. Drew of
5 years/$70M (2007-11)
signed as a free agent 1/07
07:$14M, 08:$14M, 09:$14M, 10:$14M, 11:$14M
limited no-trade clause allowing Drew to block deals to 2 clubs
$9M of 2011 salary will be deferred at 1% interest unless Drew plays 500 games from 2007 to 2010 or 375 games from 2008 to 2010
$2M signing bonus
05:$9M, 06-09:$11M/year
escape clause gives Drew right to leave as free agent after 2006
signed as a free agent 12/04
1 year/$4.2M (2004), avoided arbitration 1 /04
1 year/$3.7M (2003), avoided arbitration 1 /03
1 year/$3.1M (2002), signed 1 /02
4 years/$7M (1998-2001)
It appears that his reputation hasn’t hurt his wallet
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
IMO his act has worn thin
and he has lost alot of his effectiveness. His clients didn’t have the biggest paydays or the best contracts in the draft and his negotiation with A-Rod and the Yankees turned into a mess last year. It will be interesting to see what would happen if this Pirates-Alvarez situation would blow up in his face. Boras appears to have a good summer setup for himself with the Texeira/Manny contract negotiations but if he would happen to screw one of those up he might be on the downside of his career.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think if you look at his track record
…both FA’s and draftees over the last few years, you’ll see that he’s the most effective agent in baseball. He didn’t represent all of the top 10 draftees, but he never does. He got good outcomes for all of his clients, as always. He got huge money for his FA’s, as he always does. He and A-Rod disagreed, so A-Rod went his own way. Boras could have gotten him more money elsewhere, but A-Rod wanted to go with the Yankees. That’s what happens when a player and an agent fundamentally disagree; the player changes agents. There is no question that he is far and away the best agent at getting a player the most money. There isn’t even a close second.
I don’t like him. I don’t think he is good for baseball. But you can’t say he isn’t the best at getting the most money for his clients.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He is definitely good but he is fortunate also
He signed A-Rod and Drew at young ages and they have been loyal to him. A-Rod’s talent and personal greed created his contract in Texas. While some players are greedy not all. it was a perfect storm for A-Rod/Drew and in turn Boras benefited. I think he got embarrassed that Posey got a bigger contract than Alvarez and Matusz got a major league contract. Boras who prides himself at saying he did the best can’t say that this year.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
While some players are greedy not all.
Players almost always go for the biggest contract offer they can get. Is that being greedy? If so, then a tremendous, overwhelming majority of players are greedy. I just see it as them trying to maximize their value in the market and getting their fair share of the billions of dollars that MLB teams rake in every year. And, like it or not, Boras does a better job than anyone of getting players the most money. And that is what they want 98 times out of 100.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Boras does a better job than anyone of getting players the most money.
That used to be true I don’t know if he can say that currently after the draft and the ARod explosion.
Boras could have gotten him more money elsewhere, but A-Rod wanted to go with the Yankees.
ARod didn’t stay because he was loyal to NY, if you believe that you’ve been read the Post rag too much, he stayed because they had the biggest contract for him and he fired Boras because he thought he lied to him about the Yanks interest in him.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That used to be true I don’t know if he can say that currently after the draft and the ARod explosion.
First, that sounds like an awfully small sample size. Second, with regard to the draft, he’s no longer the best why? Because Matusz got a major league contract and Alvarez didn’t? Is that it? The fact that the #1 pick got more money than the #2 certainly doesn’t argue against Boras’s effectiveness. Third, Boras tried to get A-Rod the most money, and A-Rod chose to stay with the Yankees. Boras can’t get his client the most money when his client would rather stay with the Yankees than freely test the market. In short, not getting more money was because of the client’s priorities, not Boras’s inability to get him more money.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
beckham got like a million less in todays dollars...
then alvarez did….when you spread money out over 5 years like they do for two sport athletes it brings the value of the money down quite a bit
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Aug 29, 2008 7:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Posey got more money than Alvarez and Matusz got a ML deal. A-Rod would have been more than happy to switch zipcodes if what Boras was telling him was true. He felt like he lied to him that is why he got dumped not because of his clients priorities he got fired because he didn’t trust him anymore. Sample size only applies if you are talking Boras was the best agent for a long period of time. I don’t believe he is the best agent currently.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 7:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you say he got dumped/fired....
but who is collecting 5-10% of arods next $300 million
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Aug 29, 2008 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was originally agreed upon
and who is collecting on any new deals he is making (Guy Oseary) and who is arbitrating a ARod divorce (Boras).
I think this is big summer for Boras’ future if he wants to continue being the big agent bully. Tex and Manny have to break the bank. If Manny doesn’t draw the market he thought he should he might consider it a failure to have created a ruckus in Boston. Either way it’s not like Boras will be working in a soup kitchen. He used to be the best and now he is average.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
scott boras is Arods baseball agent
guy oseary is his business manager or whatever….not sure if that was ever boras’ thing…his business stuff doesnt matter….
shockingly enough, when theres hundreds of millions of dollars at stake rather than a couple/year, arod goes with the best around
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Aug 29, 2008 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who negotiated his previous endorsement deals?
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 8:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Obviously you have an affinity for him
so I’ll end this now. I believe his results over the last year speak for his declining effectiveness. This Alvarez charade is nothing more than grasping at straws to try to earn the title of highest paid rookie as I have said before. Every few years he gets these young guys to go along with it like Drew/ARod did when they were young. Say what you will but that loss of 300k could cost Alvarez alot more if he would get injured in indy ball.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 8:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think any of us have an affinity for him
We just see how great of a job he does for his clients. I think the fact that you don’t like what he’s done to baseball biases you against him so much that you think he’s not getting great results for his clients. The totality of the evidence says you are very wrong.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The totallity doesn't speak of anything.
It speaks for nothing more than the players own personal desire. Pujols took a hometown discount does that make his agent/agency bad at what they do? If you want to count the $ signs as the only possible way of evaluating a agents effectiveness then obviously Boras is the best. But how much more money did Boras antics(press release at the WS) cost ARod in endorsements, other teams pursuing ARod, etc. That left a bad taste in 90% of America and cost A Rod some more money.
I’m not debating whether Boras has made his clients the most money over time that is obvious but how outstanding he is currently at his job is debateable in my opinion.
Look at Jeter, he is less talented slightly older than ARod and he makes more in endorsements with his agent Casey Close. I just am not overly impressed with what Boras does the way you guys are. Players are fickle and not that intelligent with money, they stick together like wolves if one had success then the rest follow. Look at Drew Rosenhaus, even Master P had some clients if he would have known his ass from a hat he might still be doing it.
My baseball bias has nothing do with it as baseball isn’t even my favorite sport.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 8:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The totallity doesn’t speak of anything. It speaks for nothing more than the players own personal desire
You’re really off the deep end here. The totality of the evidence shows that Boras is better at getting the most money for his clients than any other agent, period. And it’s been that way for quite a while.
If you want to count the $ signs as the only possible way of evaluating a agents effectiveness then obviously Boras is the best.
How many times do I have to say that he’s the best at getting his clients the most money? Did I say that he’s the best at maximizing his clients happiness or fulfilling their spirit?
But how much more money did Boras antics(press release at the WS) cost ARod in endorsements, other teams pursuing ARod, etc.
Not a penny. In fact, A-Rod is so big, so popular and so well known now that immediately after signing the new deal with the Yankees, he signed on with the most elite entertainment representation agency in the planet, the William Morris Agency, to represent him in his various endorsements and whatever else he does in the entertainment industry.
I’m not debating whether Boras has made his clients the most money over time that is obvious but how outstanding he is currently at his job is debateable in my opinion.
And so far, you’ve got two debatable data points, Matusz getting a MLB contract while Alvarez didn’t and the A-Rod thing. Two data points show that he’s not so good at his job anymore? Come on, you’re going to have to do better than that.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And so far, you’ve got two debatable data points, Matusz getting a MLB contract while Alvarez didn’t and the A-Rod thing. Two data points show that he’s not so good at his job anymore? Come on, you’re going to have to do better than that.
Considering my point is he is no longer the best at what he is doing and those 3 things are his most recent contracts then no I don’t have to do better.
Not a penny. In fact, A-Rod is so big, so popular and so well known now that immediately after signing the new deal with the Yankees, he signed on with the most elite entertainment representation agency in the planet, the William Morris Agency, to represent him in his various endorsements and whatever else he does in the entertainment industry.
That is as dumb a statement as I have ever heard. Obviously you don’t have much background with William Morris as they also represent a friend of mine after he booked a Nintendo NES commercial and ad campaign. Their client list is very very long. Not saying ARod doesn’t have earning potential but signing with William Morris is more about them than it is the client.
Anyway I’ve grown tired of this debate. Boras was the best and still isn’t chopped liver but I think his rep is about as inflated as his ego. As I have already proven.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 9:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Considering my point is he is no longer the best at what he is doing and those 3 things are his most recent contracts then no I don’t have to do better.
First, those three things are two things. Second, you are ignoring all of the contracts signed by the other players he represents which have been signed over the last 8 months. Looks like you are cherry picking. Even the best hitter has had at least 3 strikeouts in the last 8 months, no?
That is as dumb a statement as I have ever heard.
Now you’re just getting ridiculous.
Anyway I’ve grown tired of this debate.
Thank god.
As I have already proven.
Good lord. You think your limited and very debatable examples have proven something? Boy, when you get into these debates, you really lose track of reality sometimes.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But I do like that debate tactic
I think from now on during a prolonged debate, I’m just going to say, “I’m sorry, but I’ve proven that I’m correct. No need to discuss anymore. I’ve proven it.” I like that. It has a certain eccentric flair.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What have you proved?
Oh thats right you quoted his past. He did nothing more in the draft than any other agent/agency and he did cost ARod money in the the long term by doing damage to his image. Whether you want to admit that or not it is true. Now he is putting Pedro Alvarez career in minor jeopardy. I say Boras is off his rocker and is no longer the best agent in baseball. I’ll go will Jeters agent. For him to get DJ that kind of money with half the skills as ARod I’ll go with him.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 10:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh and I can't take credit for the flair
a friend of mine you used to do that all the time. Kind of frustrating isn’t it.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 10:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's not so much funny as it is silly
It’s like arguing with a little kid and then the kid says “I win!”
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 10:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Neither of us have proven anything
We are arguing our points and providing evidence to support them. That’s it.
he did cost ARod money in the the long term by doing damage to his image.
What evidence do you have that Boras did damage to ARod’s image. Actually by taking over the negotiations from Boras, he came out looking like the hero, the good guy who overruled his ‘evil agent’. So, what evidence do you have to support the contention that ARod’s image has been hurt by Boras. Anything?
Now he is putting Pedro Alvarez career in minor jeopardy.
By getting him more money? Or by having him go to indy ball for a year? That will put his career in jeopardy just like it did for J.D. Drew, Jason Varitek and Luke Hochevar. Boy if only their careers hadn’t been ruined.
I say Boras is off his rocker and is no longer the best agent in baseball.
Yeah, he’s off his rocker just like when he tried to get J.D. Drew declared a FA after he was drafted, didn’t sign and signed with an indy team. It didn’t work, but he ended up getting more money for his client. He’s thinking outside the box and working hard to get the most money for his client. It works.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So, what evidence do you have to support the contention that ARod’s image has been hurt by Boras. Anything?
Boras didn’t do that though. ARod saved his image and the only reason he had to was cuz Boras was a jackass in the first place. You are giving Boras credit for something ARod had to do.
By getting him more money? Or by having him go to indy ball for a year? That will put his career in jeopardy just like it did for J.D. Drew, Jason Varitek and Luke Hochevar. Boy if only their careers hadn’t been ruined.
Yes exactly, he agreed to a very good contract and now he is gonna go play indy ball where he could get injured over 300k. That is a risk.
Off his rocker, yes he continually tries to create these scenarios in which his clients try to become free agents all because it worked one time. One of these times his client is gonna get injured in indy ball and will be left with a insurance policy.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Boras didn’t do that though. ARod saved his image and the only reason he had to was cuz Boras was a jackass in the first place. You are giving Boras credit for something ARod had to do.
You said that boras “cost ARod money in the long term by doing damage to his image.” I’m still waiting for evidence that a) any damage was done to ARod’s image and, b) that this has or will cost ARod money. You’ve offered none.
Yes exactly, he agreed to a very good contract and now he is gonna go play indy ball where he could get injured over 300k. That is a risk.
And that risk has paid off time and time again. Name me the Boras client college draftee who turned down a big contract, went to Indy ball and then didn’t end up getting more money in the next year’s draft? Can you name one? I named three who did this and ended up getting more money.
Off his rocker, yes he continually tries to create these scenarios in which his clients try to become free agents all because it worked one time. One of these times his client is gonna get injured in indy ball and will be left with a insurance policy.
Yes, he’s so off his rocker that his strategies get huge money for his clients (which is what they want, or they would pick a different agent). Like it or not, his tactics work. And with regard to the risk of going to indy ball, you have to weigh risks against benefits. The benefits outweigh the risks and all of the examples I can think of have paid off big.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can't debate with an insane man
I’ve offered you examples of how he has been beat recently. Not only by other agents during the draft but also the Yankees. Can I tell you exactly how much the ARod negotiations cost him no I can’t that doesn’t make you right. Do you understand that? According to reports 350-400M was out there for the taking and Boras’s attitude drove Hank away from negotiating with him. Maybe ARod did only want to play for the Yanks it doesn’t matter because Boras’ ego and tactics created a wedge between other parties and limited his negotiating leverage. For you to deny that is ridiculous.
It is also wrong for you to say that the letter didn’t damage his image again and not cost him money because it angered Hank and also upstaged the Red Sox and drove them away from any possibility of looking at ARod which in turn cost him money. It hurt his image in the public which in turn cost him fans and marketing dollars that no matter how well ARod put a bandaid on it can never totally be recouped. Can I put a exact dollar figure on it, no but any person with a rudimentary knowledge of advertising can figure out. Just because ARod patched the hole in the boat doesn’t mean Boras didn’t do damage. There are countless articles about ARod’s bad image google them. Why does ARod the highest paid player in the game make less than Jeter in endorsements maybe cuz he is a jackass. A image that Boras helped create thru his dealings with Texas and NY.
Prove to me Boras got the most out of the deal that he could. Oh that’s right you can’t. Prove to me Boras got the most out of the Hosmer/Alvarez negotiations, oh you can’t again. He didn’t do anything that the other agents/agency can do.
Just because a agent/player holds out doesn’t mean he did the best job as an agent. You act as if Harrington held out under only his own advice and in the end it was his fault and not Boras’ that is complete bunk and you know it. Boras knew Harringtons fastball was mush and still didn’t have his client sign the Padres best deal possible instead trying to blame everything on Tanzer. He was acting under advice he received from his agent. He advised that there will be a different team that will offer more and when the contracts stop coming what did Boras lose? Nothing.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve offered you examples of how he has been beat recently. Not only by other agents during the draft but also the Yankees.
Two examples. Two. In eight months, you’ve got two examples. And I’m supposed to buy that he’s “losing it”? Come on.
Can I tell you exactly how much the ARod negotiations cost him no I can’t that doesn’t make you right. Do you understand that?
Yes, I understand that. I’m just saying that you made the allegation that Boras has hurt ARod’s image and cost him money. I’m just looking for you to provide some support for that. It just sounds like speculation or assumption without any real support.
Maybe ARod did only want to play for the Yanks it doesn’t matter because Boras’ ego and tactics created a wedge between other parties and limited his negotiating leverage. For you to deny that is ridiculous.
Are you saying that Boras’s tactics kept other teams from bidding on ARod? For you to argue that is ridiculous. Multiple teams bid on every other elite FA who is a Boras client. His tactics don’t scare them away. But suddenly with ARod they did? Again, show me some evidence of why this was completely different from every other Boras client situation.
It hurt his image in the public which in turn cost him fans and marketing dollars
Again, you keep saying this without any support or evidence to back up your assertions. Do you think saying over and over again is going to prove it? You’re guessing. That’s all. You assume it must hurt his image. In reality, his image was actually helped because he overruled the big, bad agent. It only helped him.
You act as if Harrington held out under only his own advice and in the end it was his fault and not Boras’ that is complete bunk and you know it.
Yet again, you need to get your facts straight. When Harrington turned down the big signing bonus when he was first draft, Boras was not his agent. Boras became his agent in later drafts. Boras was not involved in Harrington’s big screw up.
I’m done with your guesswork, assumptions and this silly argument. Feel free to continue it without me.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
again you are wrong
Again you offer no examples of anything so I guess that is your proof of being right? Straightjacket anyone? What are your examples he is the best. No proof is not proof at all. As for Harrington you are wrong again. Tanzer was his agent for only the first contract Boras was his agent after that and he didn’t act in his clients best interest even with his clients declining statistics. You are acting like Boras and all agents only job is negotiate contracts and negotiate with teams. His job is to protect his clients image and maximize his longterm money making capability. He didn’t do that for Harrington or ARod. He could be hurting Hosmer and Alvarez longterm future as well. Prove to me he currently is better than the others. According to Boras himself 350-400m was there for the taking and in the end ARod had to agree to 300. I’ll take his words over yours so therefore Boras great letter tactic and smug dealings with Hank cost ARod 50-100M
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dude
BORAS DID NOT SCREW UP HARRINGTON.
Maybe it’ll sink in now.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 30, 2008 1:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You need to reread the Harrington gaff
Tanzer was his initial agent but Boras left a couple million more on the table as well. I put just as much blame on Boras because he saw a player who wasn’t performing in the indy league and instead of having him take the 1.5M+ offer from the Padres or the minor league deal after his Fastball fell 10 mph from the Rays he continued to advise him to holdout for more. I find it hard to believe he would rather continue to play indy ball as opposed to signing one of those deals.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 30, 2008 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tanzer is just as big
of a puke as Boras in the Harrington situation but Boras is not innocent either.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 30, 2008 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It was Tanzer's stupidity
which caused Harrington’s value to plummet off the table. Yes, Boras erred on the second-go-round as well, but Tanzer cost Harrington far, far more than Boras did.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 30, 2008 7:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
find me another agent who has come even close...
to getting a player $18 million per year after OPS+ing 88
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Aug 31, 2008 12:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Look at the latest track record.
Fired = Bonds, ARod, Kenny Rogers, I’m sure I’m leaving some out.
Ticked off teams possibly costing clients money=Damon, ARod and I’m sure again some others
Outdone in the ’08 Draft=Posey/Matusz contracts.
Do you guys understand the fact I’m NOT DENYING HE USED TO BE THE BEST. Hello he has lost something can you not see that?
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 31, 2008 12:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fired = Bonds, ARod, Kenny Rogers, I’m sure I’m leaving some out.
ARod didn’t fire him. Boras is still his agent. Bonds isn’t even in baseball anymore. I have a feeling Boras dropped Bonds. Rogers was doing a simple deal to stay with the same team, so he didn’t need an agent at all. I think he and his lawyer did that deal from what I read.
Ticked off teams possibly costing clients money=Damon, ARod and I’m sure again some others
Baseless speculation. Boras keeps “ticking off teams” and his clients keep getting offered huge sums of money by these teams.
I’m NOT DENYING HE USED TO BE THE BEST.
Using all caps isn’t going to change the fact that you’ve got two data points as “proof” that Boras is suddenly “losing it.” Alvarez and ARod. Two data points. That’s it. Do you see how that is woefully insufficient to prove your point? Or would it have more impact if I say, DO YOU SEE HOW THAT IS WOEFULLY INSUFFICIENT TO PROVE YOUR POINT?
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 31, 2008 12:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh yeah
And if you are going to bring up ARod to support your contention that he’s losing it, isn’t A.Jones $18M per year contract a relevant data point too? And that happened in the same month as ARod’s deal.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 31, 2008 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are ridiculous and that is why this is pointless
You have yet to prove that he is still the best in any way. All you do is deny my claims without providing any proof of them. I’ve given you countless explanations and good reasons to why he continues to get clients and good contracts and why he isn’t the best and is just average now. As for the baseless speculation you spew you obviously don’t understand that more potential suitors means more leverage for your client. As for the Andruw Jones deal I don’t see a 2 year deal for a 30 year old outfielder who was one season removed from a 126+OPS and 2 seasons from a runner-up mvp finish as some great feat. The guy was 30 with one bad year that could be easily explained as an aberation to uncertainity of having a longterm deal. For Boras to only get his client 2 years to me explains his ineffectiveness. Jones had a long history of good to great seasons and at only 30 years old Boras could only get him 2 years. That is garbage. Randy Johnson’s agent at 41 years of age got his client 2 years 57 million from the Yankees and then after 2 bad years with the Yanks he got him 2 years 26 million from the Dbacks. Same length and just as much money for a much much older player.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 31, 2008 12:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I get it
Everybody’s wrong about Boras. Me, the mainstream media, the alternative media, contrarian sabermetricians, everybody. Everybody is wrong about him and you’re right. His reputation is all smoke and mirrors and you see through it. I get it. I have to get out of this amazingly silly discussion.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 31, 2008 3:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wait, I just noticed something, kscoliny
You finally admitted that he used to be the best. You agreed with the conventional wisdom. But you think he’s “losing it.” And the entirety of the evidence that you have that he’s losing it is two data points: Alvarez’s and ARod’s contracts. Two data points. That’s it. So he was the best and then two data points prove that he’s losing it and he’s no longer the best. Do you really not get how two contracts are entirely insufficient to prove that?
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 31, 2008 4:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
especially considering
that neither of those is a particularly good argument….
arod got the richest contract in baseball history….a 10 year deal for a 32 year old player….
and alvarez, while he didnt get the MOST money….he did get more than the #1 pick in todays dollars
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Aug 31, 2008 4:31 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
keep in mind PEOPLE EARN THEIR REPUTATIONS
Don't forget to send your broken maples to the US Forest Service.
by 306008 on Aug 31, 2008 9:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
we're not talking about success
stories here.
Don't forget to send your broken maples to the US Forest Service.
by 306008 on Aug 31, 2008 8:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
again and again
you guys have not done any research and continue to argue about old successes and that is why he is the best now. NY I continually repeated above he used to be the best but you didn’t want to read it apparently as you only read parts of people responses. The sabermetrics statements are old and over done again you quote old facts. Where is the current data?
Who says he currently/still is the best? Over the last two years he has continually been ripped for his decisions and negotiations skills. Your rebuttal about Rogers and Bonds was weak and illinformed by the way. Bonds booted him out of the Giants negotiations the way ARod did.
You guys continually speak to his past performance as the only answer and still can’t provide any proof of it. Your proof was AJ. A contract that totally blew up in his face and was a total lack of his current performance. He didn’t get ARod his money, ARod did, he didnt get Bonds his money Bonds did, he drove away Boston from the table on both the ARod and Damon deals thus limiting his power to negotiate.
Your proof of Jones is totally laughable 2 year 36million for a player with his past success who is only 30 compared to Torii Hunters 5 90 for a 1 year older player. That’s success? Where are the recent successes that he did? I can name one JD Drew.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 31, 2008 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Continued Below.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 31, 2008 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
bonds kicked boras to the curb like arod...
so, boras made 5% of Bonds $20 million last year too?
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Sep 1, 2008 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't understand how Boras
gets credit in your mind for either ARod or Bonds, great job Scott you got booted from the negotiation table. WAY TO GO! He had a contract with them, that is why he gets the 5% not because he did a good job.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Sep 1, 2008 9:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ARod could have fired Boras at any time
He didn’t. Boras is still his agent. Why do you think that is? I guess ARod is buying the baseles PR hype like everyone else.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Sep 1, 2008 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why does he get the best players at an early age?
probably b/c his scouting budget is similar to many major league teams….
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Aug 29, 2008 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it really makes sense...
even if you sit out and only make a couple hundred thousand more dollars…it delays their FA by a year…maybe…if you’re talking about guys getting big FA contracts, does an extra $10 million lost, make as much difference as the difference b/w $3 million and $3.3 million? I’d say no….and judging by the attrition rates of even top prospects, that 300k likely will have more of an adverse affect on their life than that 10 million on top of the other 70 or so
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Aug 29, 2008 7:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I see the Hosmer situation just a by-product of schrewed tactics by Pit
It is a horrible outcome for Hosmer, but at least, worse case scenario KC still gets pick 3a, or the 5th overall pick, if both contracts are voided.
Boras wanted to take a hard stance with Pit. They returned fire by trying to hit the only thing Boras understands, his pocket book.
Do you really thing Boras is going to retain both Hosmer and Alvarez if they lose their college eligibility and their MLBontracts at the same time?
by laxtonto on Aug 29, 2008 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If not, they should sue his ass
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 29, 2008 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is a nightmare....
So Boras is not only screwing the Pirates in this deal, but not because of him, Hosmer and KC are being held hostage as well?
I’m wondering if this is going to affect his already poor relations with MLB organizations even more. It’s going to get to the point that no one is going to want to deal with this guy
by laxtonto on Aug 29, 2008 2:19 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Why would Boras give a crap?
Both of these guys are his clients and he has a small possibility of them becoming free agents. That seems to be what he has always fought for in the past and since there is no precedent in this matter he might just get his wish. Doubtful but what does he really have to lose?
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 2:24 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
clients
Teams to negotiate with.
Respect.
MONEY.
Don't forget to send your broken maples to the US Forest Service.
by 306008 on Aug 29, 2008 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not really
Boras doesn’t care about respect he cares about money. If by some act of god he can force the commissioner into making Alvarez a FA and in turn his other client (Hosmer) then he will be the big winner. What is the worst can happen in Boras’s world? Alvarez sits and plays indy ball in turn probably becoming the #1 or 2 pick again next year which is gonna be a larger paycheck. MLB is kind of in a spot because it is too late for them to enroll back in school. The big winner in this whole thing could be the teams that didn’t get their first round pick signed, ie the Yanks and Nats.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Texas Hold'um
Scott Boras, the Priates, the Royals, and the players association set down to a game.
Scott looks down at a 8 5 of spades, and goes in for three times the big blind
Pirates look at a Ace King offsuit and go all in
The Players Association has a pair of Jacks and goes all in
Royals have a 7 2 offsuit and quickly fold
Action back on Boras
“Damn! I was just trying to steal the blinds!”
Go Royals!
by BabyBlues on Aug 29, 2008 3:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Usually people defend Boras with
“He’s only doing what his clients want him to do.”
Now, he’s shown that he negotiates in bad faith. I’ve never liked him, but now I feel justified in considering him scum, rather than just a cutthroat agent.
Chaim Mattis Keller New York City's # 1 Royals fan!
by cmkeller on Aug 29, 2008 4:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
MLBPA seems to think Hosmer's contract is legit
The union will contend further that the Pirates’ case was the only one in question. The Pirates have cited the Kansas City Royals’ talks with first baseman Eric Hosmer as having gone past midnight, but the Royals’ position is that an agreement was reached before midnight and all that was missing was approval.
The union will contend that the Royals’ approval was delayed – as well as that of possibly one other team – just so the Pirates could have extra time with Alvarez.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Aug 29, 2008 4:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The plot continues to thicken
If the parties (Royals and Hosmer/Boras) agree that they agreed to a $6M deal before midnight, then that contract is safe and would not be affected by any ruling on Alvarez’s situation.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Star is saying that it is Major League Baseball who has asked/told Hosmer to sit for the time being while the Alvarez mess is being figured out
http://www.kansascity.com/sports/royals/story/773317.html
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 5:53 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm sure he is ecstatic with his agent about that.
by djk royal on Aug 29, 2008 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm just happy that this wasn't at all Hosmer's decision
Everything so far has said that Homser and Boras are happy with his deal. As long as it stays that way, we are safe. The fact that MLBPA is segregating Hosmer’s situation out of the grievance they have filed is also a very positive sign.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Unless
Somehow it is ruled that signing after the deadline makes you a free agent. A long shot, but that seems to be Boras’ argument.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Aug 29, 2008 7:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If I understand it correctly
…Boras and the MLBPA are saying that there was no agreement (whether signed or not) between Alvarez and the Pirates before the deadline. However, they are saying that there was an agreement between Hosmer and the Royals before the deadline, but the deal just hadn’t been approved by MLB and signed until after the deadline. Since Boras and the MLBPA are apparently sticking to that description of the facts, I think it would be exceptionally difficult to say that the Royals deal with Hosmer was outside of the rules.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And I think we actually need to give Boras a clap here.
Clearly, he could have used this to bump Hosmer as well. He’s obviously going out of his way to help protect the Royals’ investment in a draft pick and good-faith negotiation with his client, which leads me to believe the Royals’ relationship with Boras really IS a good, productive one now.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 29, 2008 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll give him a clap if he can talk Tex into giving KC a hometown discount
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 8:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Instead he'll do what every agent does
Try to get his client the most money. And he’ll do it better than any other.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 29, 2008 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or he'll do it at an equal level
and brag like he does it better than anyone else. That in the end is what Rosenhaus and Boras do better than anyone else.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 30, 2008 12:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good lord
Whatever. Apparently his reputation for being the most effective at getting the most money (which I’ve read repeated by not just the mainstream media but also more forward thinking analysts at BP and THT) is entirely undeserved. I appreciate you thinking outside the box, kcscoliny.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 30, 2008 12:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
outside the box?
Sorry I’m not buying the hypemachine. You and I know Boras does alot more than you are outlining for everyone on here. Between his coaching clinics, negotiations and media persona he is a media monster who creates his bigger than life image. Yes he has brokered some big deals but that is because he had the clients to do it with. Being a good agent when you are dealing with the ultimate in players isn’t that difficult of a task in my opinion. For god sakes look at Lebron James newest agent. Boras is a hype machine who has had the best players. I look at deals like Hamilton knowing he had a declining commodity and holding out as evidence of how he doesn’t do what is best for his clients. Yes it has worked out with a few players but the risk/reward isn’t worth it when you look at the Hamilton case. Boras never knew how Hoch was gonna pitch or Drew was gonna hit in these indy leagues. Hamilton stunk that first year and it cost him 3+ million, then he stunk again and it cost him 1+ million, then again.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 30, 2008 12:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Boras is a hype machine who has had the best players.
Why do you think he gets the best players? Because he gets the best results.
Boras never knew how Hoch was gonna pitch or Drew was gonna hit in these indy leagues.
He didn’t? Those indy leagues have crappy talent, so of course they were going to dominate. And, what is most important is not the stats, which are going to be great and pretty meaningless. What matters is how the player looks in the workouts when the scouts come to view him. And it’s not like an elite talent 21-year-old is going to lose his skills in one year. It wasn’t much of a risk at all.
As far as the “hype machine” goes, I wouldn’t put much stock in the mainstream media hype surrounding Boras. But when the sabermetrics guys agree too (and they look at the numbers and don’t just blindly buy into the hype), then there’s something real there. Boras’s reputation is well earned. You’re going against a lot of intelligent informed people here (I’m not talking about myself) without any real data to support your claim that he’s just a pretty good agent whose reputation is all PR hype.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 30, 2008 1:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You have to admit, though
That Boras also leads the history of sports agency in “dollars potentially lost to utter blunder.” I mean, unless A-Rod is a moron, Boras cost himself $15 million last year.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 30, 2008 1:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He does play a higher risk, higher reward strategy
And his wins have greatly exceeded his losses. And the benefits have exceeded the risks. That’s why he’s been so successful.
But I don’t think that Boras necessarily caused him to get less money. Without going into all of the reasons for this, one needs to look at how much money ARod should get under this contract. In addition to all of the salary, there is the massive amount of money he gets when he breaks the various home run records which essentially amounts to revenue sharing with the Yankees. That kicks the total value of the contract up greatly.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 30, 2008 2:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No no no
Boras cost Boras $15 million, unless A-Rod is an idiot, because if I had to tell my agent “STFU and go away” and negotiate my own deal, he sure as shit wouldn’t be getting his 5% cut.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 30, 2008 3:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But Boras is still his agent
And even if Boras did not negotiate the contract, he still gets his commission. That is unless Boras and ARod have some sort of very atypical agent-client agreement. ARod could have fired Boras at any point, but he didn’t.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 30, 2008 3:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, then A-Rod's an idiot.
Boras has repeatedly noted he’s merely a baseball agent, and that his clients generally have outside “business managers.” If Boras did not negotiate Alex’s contract, Boras did nothing to earn his money, and I’d have fired his ass the moment I had to step in and handle it myself.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 30, 2008 3:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
NY
you seem to underplay what Boras does. I think you need to do some more research on him. He likes to say all he does is negotiate baseball players contracts but everyone who has done some research on him knows he is far and away a bigger influence than that to his clients. And to say he didn’t do anything to cost ARod/Harrington is underplaying his great gaffs in those situations. His role as an agent is far more in depth than you are admitting. You play him off as merely an advisor. Therefore allowing you to not be shown how wrong you are because you are taking such a narrow point of view of him. MLB teams, other agents and some players have caught onto his negotiating tactics and have even rewritten rules to not allow him to bend old school rules. While that was great while it lasted and allowed him to create a HUGE pocketbook and a windfall of cash for his clients it also hasn’t allowed him to adapt his ways and therefore his tactics have remained old school and allowed others to become better at the game. Will he go broke, no, will players continue to come his way, yes because as I explained above athletes are loyal and narrow minded. In the end his client list will continue to diminish if he doesn’t change how he deals with the draft and how he deals with the teams. So in the end I agree to disagree with you about Boras.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 30, 2008 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
boras IS his agent...
and worked with the yankees on all of the details of the contract…the basic 10/300 was all that Arod did on his own….his limo rides, his hotel suites, his ridiculous incentive clauses…all boras
whoever was saying that boras hurt arod’s marketing potential…you really think that one poorly timed announcement is more damaging to arods marketability than him repeatedly being caught cheating on his wife? or the fact that he’s never won anything?
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Aug 31, 2008 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, Jeter's great image...
…comes from him playing his entire career in the biggest media market in the country and playing on teams that won multiple rings. ARod has had neither. Jeter’s great image isn’t because his agent isn’t as hardass as Boras. To somehow give Jeter’s agent credit for his image and ability to rake in the endorsement deals is ludicrous beyond belief.
This is just my opinion. I could easily be wrong.
by NYRoyal on Aug 31, 2008 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As much as I've sort of "stuck up" for Boras on occasion
I’d really enjoy it if he got gonhorrea. Nice suggestion, morse.
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 30, 2008 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Scott's goal in this is two fold...
A) His initial goal is to have Alvarez granted Free Agency. Something I think has about ZERO percent chance of happening. Now, as to whether or not this is Boras, or Alvarez’s wishes, I’ll leave it up to speculation. My gut feeling is that Alvarez had a list of teams he DID NOT want to get drafted by, and Pitt was probably one of them (as was KC, seeing as we are both viewed as poorly ran orgs), and Boras probably told him that he has a 1 in a hundred shot of getting him out of ever going there…
B) He wants to get rid of the August 15 deadline REALLY BAD. It shortens the time for negotiations obviously, and in his mind, he thinks it lessens the sense of ‘have to get this done no matter what the cost’ in the teams mind.
by GoBabies!! on Aug 29, 2008 11:12 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Interesting take on Bucs Dugout that no one on here has talked about
at least to my knowledge. Julo Borbon last year agreed to a contract with the Rangers after the deadline. If MLB agrees that the contracts agreed to after the deadline are invalid then Borbon could claim his is as well. I doubt that info will help Boras’s case because I’m sure MLB doesn’t want to open that can of worms.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 29, 2008 11:36 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That situation
is actually a precedential data point in MLB’s favor, since that was allowed to occur without any objection whatsoever.
The main thrust of things is that most arbitration experts agree that there is no way in hell Shyam Dyas declares anyone to be a free agent over this. At worst, he’ll instruct MLB and the union to formulate a policy regarding extensions and/or close any loopholes surrounding the deadline.
Sarcasm™. It's the new gravy.
by jonfmorse on Aug 30, 2008 1:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I bet this little move by Boras will lose him all of his clients
save one: a plucky wide receiver with the Arizona Cardinals, who is long in talent but short on heart.
This space intentionally left blank.
by marbotty on Aug 30, 2008 3:26 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
In Rod we Trust!
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Aug 30, 2008 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ah The Quan
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 30, 2008 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They switched Matt Leinheart to receiver?
And he acquired talent?
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by devil_fingers on Aug 30, 2008 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hardball time article
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 30, 2008 1:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I will try to tone down the heat in my argurment as my comments have gotten a bit out of control. In the end I believe Boras’s tactics are stale and overused. The teams have adapted to them and have even drawn up rules against some of them. If he continues down his current path he will continue to lose clients, get fired and remain very very rich(who cares about the future he is loaded). So what is the reason he will change, there isn’t one he’ll continue to do what he is doing because it has worked in the past. I believe he is dealing with smarter and smarter GM’s that don’t cave to his tactics so easily and that is why he will continue to get the results that he has recently. Teams are used to his draft strategy and free agent strategy, wait and wait some more but that isn’t creating the best results for his clients. I know this if I had a choice as a drafted college player I would choose Posey’s/Matusz/Beckham deal over what Alvarez/Hosmer is going thru. It gets them to the prime money faster and do you believe any of these guys don’t view themselves as pro players. And as for the other recent contracts really only the Drew deal was success created by Boras and that one could be deemed as Epstein/Henry love for Drew over Boras ability. That doesn’t matter though because it still is chalked up as a Boras win.
I just don’t see his old skill or ability. I used to think what he did was quite amazing but recently I believe he is harming his clients ability to make money more than he is helping it.
Every fight is a food fight when you’re a cannibal.
-- Demetri Martin
by kcscoliny on Aug 31, 2008 12:15 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
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