The Market for Adam Dunn - Could he be a Royal?
According to this MLBTR link-story Adam Dunn might be available at a sweet rate. I mentioned earlier that he might sign with the Royals if they offered a 3/30 contract. I don't know, but maybe this is realistic.
The obvious problem, the Royals supposedly don't have $10M extra to spend this year. But why not? Glass has the money. He could raise the payroll by $10M next year. It might mean he would lose a few million in 2009, but hell, he has raked in tens of millions of profit over the last decade so I am not going to get all upset about Glass taking a short term loss to improve the team.
Another option, the Phillies are looking for right handed offense. They are one of the few teams Guillen hasn't alienated yet (I think). So maybe the Royals could eat $7M of Guillen's contract in each of the next two years and give him to Philadelphia. This would free up $5M a year. If Dunn takes a back loaded contract, say $8M/$8M/$14M swapping Guillen for Dunn would in effect only cost the Royals $3M during each of the next two years. And in 2011 when he is owed $14M the Guillen obligation will be gone.
Or, the Royals could trade Teahen or Jacobs for prospects. This would free up about $3.5M apiece. I think Dunn helps the team out a lot more than do Teahen and Jacobs.
The point I am making is that the Royals have an opportunity here and I hope Glass and Moore see that and seize it. Significant improvement is possible provided the management shows some courage and willpower. Dunn NOW!
9 months ago
James Quinn
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Sheehan wrote just a few days ago that the DH is being seriously underused by many AL teams
no way the royals do this however
by royalsreview on Feb 1, 2009 12:39 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Minus the Jacobs trade,
this scenario had a much better chance of playing out. Adding Jacobs costs the team about $3M in additional salary, and with Dunn, Butler, Shealy, Jacobs, Guillen and German the Royals are way overloaded on guys who cannot play any defensive postion even to an average level outside of 1B.
Just the same, I’d love to see the Royals do something gutsy here. This crazy off-season presents the Royals with an unexpected opportunity to upgrade provided they are willing to remain active while most other teams are afraid to make commitments.
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by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 1:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I think the Crisp trade and moving DDJ to LF...
shows how much of a premium Moore places on OF defense (as he probably should, given the likely starting rotation we’ll be using this year). I like Dunn, but I seriously doubt Moore would sign him.
by DarthYoshi on Feb 1, 2009 12:51 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I assumed Dunn would go to DH here in KC
Is this a big issue with Dunn? Is he insisting on being given a LF slot?
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by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It isn't that it is a big issue with Dunn
It is that we already have two all-stick, no-glove players in Jacobs and Butler. We’re set at DH. I wouldn’t mind a DDJ-Crisp-Dunn outfield (Hoagie is already a pretty dismal defensive RFer, Dunn can’t be that much of a downgrade from him), but I think Moore would probably mind. I don’t know how true the rips on Dunn’s lack of enthusiasm for the game are, but if there is any germ of truth to them, I don’t know why he’d make being given an OF slot a dealbreaker.
The other issue is that I’m 95% sure Dunn is a Type A free agent. We sign him, we forfeit a couple of first/second round draft picks. I’m not sure Moore would be willing to do that either.
by DarthYoshi on Feb 1, 2009 4:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
After watching Dunn play for years in Cincinnati
I can attest to the fact that he is a horrible outfielder, and that his experiment as a first baseman did not go well. He is not going to be even an okay defender at any position ever.
I really have no idea how much Dunn does or does not love playing baseball. He is a very easy going guy. He has never been a problem in the clubhouse. He almost never misses time due to injuries so he is always ready when the national anthem is played. I really do not see any clear reason for people to worry about Dunn playing poorly because he doesn’t try hard. There is nothing in his career that indicates this is the case – other than possibly him not becoming a better defensive player, but that may be due to talent and physical issues, not to effort or desire.
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by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 5:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
are you saying that Billy Baconater Butler and Mike No Glove Jacobs are better hitters than
ADAM the monster HR guy Dunn? Too bad if we already have two guys at that position. If we can get another who makes us better, let’s trade baconater for something….
That's why we play the season on paper.
by 306008 on Feb 1, 2009 5:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not saying Butler and Jacobs are better hitters
I’m saying it probably won’t happen under Moore.
And trading Butler now for anything less than an elite-level prospect and a throw-in is a bad, bad idea.
by DarthYoshi on Feb 1, 2009 5:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Butler can play DH, 1B and LF in a pinch
plus he has options. If the Royals sign Dunn they will still find ways to get Butler into the line-up. Dunn will take at bats away from Guillen, Gload and Teahen mostly.
This situation will never come down to a “Dunn or Butler” scenario.
I love Butler and would hate to lose him. I’d sooner see the Royals trade Gordon than Butler.
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by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 5:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Butler can play LF...
…in the same way that Mike Jacobs plays 1b. He could, but he’d be the worst (or close to the worst) defender in the league at that position.
If we hadn’t traded for Jacobs, signing Dunn would be easier from a roster standpoint. I don’t think Dunn would take AB’s only away from BamBam (especially since BamBam is right handed and Dunn bats left handed), but BamBam should be getting a full season’s worth of MLB AB’s in 2009.
by DarthYoshi on Feb 1, 2009 5:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I like Butler, too
and agree that he has more (potential) offensive upside than Gordon, but given their positions, it’s going to be pretty hard for him as valuable a player as Gordon, much less more valuable.
Despite Rany’s FRAA-driven panic about Gordon’s defense this summer, there’s still plenty of statistical and/or scouting evidence that he’s at least average at third, whereas Butler will be lucky to be passable at 1B. But let’s assume they are equal on defense at 1B and 3B respectively (a generous assumption for Butler0> then over 600 or 700 PAs (whatever “full season” convention you prefer, Butler needs to be about 15 runs better than Gordon on defense for them to be of equal value.
That’s slightly more than Adam Dunn’s offensive advantage over David Dejesus this year (DDJ was/is a better player overall, though). And keep in mind that’ if Billy is as good at 1B as Alex is at 3B, whereas the more likely outcome is Billy being a Dh or the equivalent, which makes the “requirement” for his offense that much greater.
Just thought I’d get that in there.
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by devil_fingers on Feb 1, 2009 11:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
These are all good points,
and all I have to say in response that I have a sense that Gordon is not going to get a whole lot better than he is now, and that Butler is going to get quite a bit better. This is just a feeling I have gotten after watching the two of them play for a few seasons.
I want the Royals to keep both of them of course. But if I had to choose only one I would go with Butler at this point. Maybe I’m wrong.
www.rockchalktalk.com for pretty good KU baseball coverage
by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 11:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We’d lose a second round pick, but that wouldn’t matter if someone would (please, please!!) sign Mark Grudzielanek. The Diamondbacks would also pick up a compensation pick. Our first round pick is secure. And while I’m always on the bandwagon to get as many picks as possible, giving up a second rounder that might not matter if Grudzielanek gets signed is not a big deal to me when obtaining a player like Adam Dunn.
by MtRoyals on Feb 1, 2009 8:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
we wouldnt lose any draft picks b/c the reds didnt offer him arbitration
TPJ...you're dead to me
by billybeingbilly on Feb 2, 2009 1:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Worth looking into
I would think Moore at least has to kick the tires here and find out just what Dunn is willing to sign for at this point. I’d certainly be in favor of it at what could be a bargain price.
by cookierojas73 on Feb 1, 2009 1:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
It seems like to much has to happen in order for this to happen
And for that I don’t think it’ll happen.
by Royal from Queens on Feb 1, 2009 1:37 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
All that really has to happen is for Glass to write the check.
All the other parts just lessen the financial burden of the proposed Dunn contract. Glass has the money in his account and he could sign Adam Dunn today and then let Moore work on how best to fit Dunn into the roster by future moves.
Even if signing Dunn meant unloading Jacobs and Gload for almost no return I would be fine with that. If I understand it correctly Gload could be cut before April 1st and since this is the last year of his contract he would only be owed 25% of his salary. (Do I understand this rule correctly?) That saves about $1.5M. And I think Jacobs could be given away for a marginal prospect. That would save another $3.5M.
Anyway, signing Dunn doesn’t require a lot of other moves. It really only requires Glass to be willing to spend the money.
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by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 1:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'll disagree
Lets be reasonable here. Everyone would want their owners to spend a shit load of money on their favorite teams but the Royals have the smallest market to work with and this affects their revenue. If there truely is a budget and since this is a business, I believe there IS a budget, then it wouldn’t make sense to take on such a financial burden if there is no way to positively get rid of the other burdens (Jacobs, Teahen, Guillen, etc).
The Royals are already at or around $70 million, give or take. That’s around the middle of the pack, and personally. I guess being cheap for 7 years allows to take all this savings and using them now.
by Royal from Queens on Feb 1, 2009 2:02 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
We could always pay him with the luxury tax money we get from the Yankees overspending.
That's why we play the season on paper.
by 306008 on Feb 1, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The whole luxory tax money is a big mystery for me
And I have no idea how it works or where the money so goes, so after all these years I’ve given up and just ignore it.
by Royal from Queens on Feb 1, 2009 2:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Luxury Tax money
doesn’t go to the teams. It just goes to a central MLB fund. What they do with it i don’t know, but it does NOT just go from the Yankees to those teams with small payrolls/revenues.
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by kcbottom9th on Feb 1, 2009 3:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I am an idiot
All it took was about 15 seconds of “research” and I get an answer.
I guess it’s been years since I was curious where it actually went.
Thanks to Dugout Dollars there is a real deal answer.
Where does the luxury tax money that is collected go?
The luxury tax money collected is split out as follows:
* The first $5m is held in reserve, to pay for possible luxury tax refunds. Once it is clear that there are no refunds to be issued, this money is then earmarked for the Industry Growth Fund (IGF).
* 50% of the remaining money is used to fund player benefits.
* 25% is used to fund baseball programs in developing countries with no high-school baseball.
* 25% is put into the Industry Growth Fund (IGF).
by Royal from Queens on Feb 1, 2009 3:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I understand your point,
but I am a fan of the team, not of Glass’ bank account. I do not know exactly how much profit the Royals have brought Glass so far but I expect it is nearly $100M. I know he took in $20M profit in one year alone (I think it was 2006). Plus the team is valued at about twice what he paid for it now. So I don’t really get too excited about protecting Glass’ yearly profit margin. I just want to see him bring in good players.
I guess my point is I do not follow baseball to cheer for Glass’ profit margin. Glass has the money to sign Dunn and I would be so happy if he did something good for the team that might not be good for his bank account for a change.
www.rockchalktalk.com for pretty good KU baseball coverage
by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 2:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I am a fan of the team, not of Glass’ bank account.
Nice…
Well, I don’t think anyone is a fan of the bank account, haha. What I’m trying to say is, you can’t have unreasonable expectations, that’s not fair. I would have liked Glass to have signed Alex Rodriguez, Mark Teixeira, Vladamir Guerrero, among others in the past years. Doesn’t mean those things are realistic or fair to expect them to be signed to our team.
I want Adam Dunn but, I don’t see it happening and I won’t hold it against them if it doesn’t happen.
by Royal from Queens on Feb 1, 2009 2:38 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If Glass does not authorise Moore to throw money at Dunn
I won’t hold it against him either. I understand Glass likes to make money. But for once, just for once, I would like to see Glass do something that rises above the level of “the least I can do without running the risk that I might possibly not make money this year.”
www.rockchalktalk.com for pretty good KU baseball coverage
by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 5:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
isn't the old adage you have to spend money to make money?
That's why we play the season on paper.
by 306008 on Feb 1, 2009 5:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually, Glass know the exact opposite is true,
at least in the case of major league baseball.
Glass has raked in profits while the Royals have suffered through a terrible stretch under his ownership.
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by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 5:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
David Glass
is a much, much better owner now than he was four years ago.
by DarthYoshi on Feb 1, 2009 5:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
True
I think he was tired of being a laughing stock.
Do you know what would make people respect Glass even more? I do. If he signed Adam Dunn to a long term contract.
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by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 5:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd love to sign Dunn to a one-year deal...
Then trade him at the break or keep him to make our run.
That's why we play the season on paper.
by 306008 on Feb 1, 2009 2:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
signing Dunn to a one-year deal...
…is a fool’s errand. A bunch of dominoes have to fall into place for us to seriously contend in 2009. 2010 and 2011 are much more likely. If we signed Dunn, it would have to be for at least two years. Plus, I doubt Dunn would go for a one-year deal.
by DarthYoshi on Feb 1, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
the market determines what a player gets...
If I was dunn, I’d rather sign a one year deal in KC with the option to be a FA again after the season than sign a multi year deal where I don’t want to player….
If we had Dunn in our offensive strapped lineup, would we contend?
That's why we play the season on paper.
by 306008 on Feb 1, 2009 5:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
hard to say
depends on how he was used and who he replaced
by royalsreview on Feb 1, 2009 5:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Dunn making the Royals a contender
Maybe? Just maybe. If the pitching holds up, and Gordon and Butler step up, it seems possible.
www.rockchalktalk.com for pretty good KU baseball coverage
by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 5:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
improvement
Without getting into the details, if Dunn replaces Guillen in the OF, he’s probably 1.5-2 wins better with the bat, but about 0.5-1 wins worse with the glove, so that’s a 0.5 – 1.5 win improvement.
If he replaced Jacobs as DH (assuming he wouldn’t take PAs from Butler), then you just compare their bats. I’d say that he’s 1.5-2 wins better than Jacobs (Jacobs is a better hitter than Guillen, but platoon issues hold him back).
I’m not sure that really makes them contenders, at least not by itself.
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by devil_fingers on Feb 1, 2009 11:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
With the market like it is now,
I think the Royals have a chance to sign Dunn to a multiyear contract at a buyers price. I’d much rather sign Dunn to a three year deal than for only 2009. I just don’t see this team as ready to make a serious run at the AL Crown in 2009 with or without Dunn.
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by James Quinn on Feb 1, 2009 5:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Dunn would be nice
if didn’t already have Jacobs. I’d also only want Dunn for one MAYBE two years. Jason Giambi signed for 1yr at $5.25 million. If we could’ve sign either of them for that price that would have been amazing. But Moore was impatient an unwise. If Moore didn’t have faith in Shealy or KK he should’ve tried to sign one of these guys. It would have let KK continue to mash in AAA for a year and still leave room for his promotion, and given us far better production at 1B/DH. But as it is Moore has swindled away the perfect offseason for a small market team like the Royals without added impact talent to our roster, excluding Crisp and the Grienke signing. All he’s done is block the KK promotion,
wasted millions on mediocre pitchers, and ensure that Callaspo and Brayan Pena won’t get the shot we need to give them. Imagine how bright it would look if we signed Dunn or Giambi, not signed Farns, Bloomy, Waetcher, Ho-Ram, or traded for Jacobs. And then had traded Buck or Olivo and maybe had even had the money to sign Sheets. This has been a terrible offseason for Moore
by SK on Feb 1, 2009 4:45 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
who says those guys deserve a shot?
Baseball isn’t like that. If you can get better, you do.
That's why we play the season on paper.
by 306008 on Feb 1, 2009 5:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well yea, but that s the issue with the Jacobs deal
he’s really not that good
by royalsreview on Feb 1, 2009 5:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Dunn
Not coming to KC.
End of story.
Founder of the Johnny Giavotella fan club.
by doublestix on Feb 1, 2009 8:03 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Dunn is the new Guillen
Any multi-year contract signed this year would be regretted next year. There has been post after post on this board talking about how signing Guillen last year ties the Royals hands this year. Wouldn’t it be the same for Dunn?
by Valcour on Feb 1, 2009 8:44 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Slight difference between Guillen and Dunn
Adam Dunn is actually productive.
by Royal from Queens on Feb 1, 2009 10:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That would be nice, but it just isn't realistic.
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 12:54 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I give this about a 1% chance of happening
We are already overbudget, we already acquired a DH, and we aren’t going to play Dunn in LF. Also, he says he wants to play for a contender (although the feeling may not be mutual).
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by RoyalsRetro on Feb 2, 2009 10:31 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Dunn probably doesn't sign a one year deal but Abreu could.
DH him and platoon him with Guillen and Coco send Billy to Omaha (gaining a year of service time ) then ship him somewhere at the break for something decent. I’m sure a team would take him and give up a decent prospect for him.
I don't know how to put this but I'm kind of a big deal.
by kcscoliny on Feb 2, 2009 12:27 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Dunn may very well sign a one-year deal
Typically a good player of his age wouldn’t do this, but for him it might make sense. Sign a one year deal, have a good season and then go back on the FA market at an age which is still young for a free agent and hopefully in a better market. And next year’s FA class really sucks.
And I really think that if he doesn’t sign a one-year contract, he’ll sign a two-year contract. Any 3-year deal that he’d get would likely be for very little money per year, so I doubt he’d go that way.
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Dunn is waiting on Manny
If Manny would somehow end up in SF or NY then Dunn lands with the Dodgers otherwise he’ll end up with the Nats for 3 years.
I don't know how to put this but I'm kind of a big deal.
by kcscoliny on Feb 2, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you are right that Manny is holding up the remaining corner OF market
But I’d be willing to bet that Dunn doesn’t sign anywhere for 3 years.
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 1:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe not
but I think if the Nats want him they will have to give him that 3rd year fixed. I think Dunn could get 2 somewhere else and he has stated he doesn’t like losing so he might just sign that 1 or 2 year deal somewhere he thinks he can win at. Although those teams are shrinking daily but I think the Giants might toss him a 2 year deal.
I don't know how to put this but I'm kind of a big deal.
by kcscoliny on Feb 2, 2009 2:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I think a decent team (better than the Nats) will offer him a decent 2-year deal
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 2:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Scary
CHONE has Manny projected as being about 2 wins better than Dunn offensively…
I’ve seen stuff around… is PECOTA out yet?
And if so, where the $#@! is NHZ with this Spreadsheet Baseball 2009 Royals Preview?
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by devil_fingers on Feb 2, 2009 2:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
PECOTA isn't out yet
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 2:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
hmmmm
I thought I saw that the Replacement Level Yankees Weblog had their PECOTA projections for the Yanks already
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by devil_fingers on Feb 2, 2009 2:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If Dunn gets
more than $8 Mil a year, I’d Be SHOCKED.
I bet he signs a one year deal with somebody in late February for about $6 Mil with a Mutual Option for a 2nd year at around $9 mil.
Look around, salaries are TANKING (rightfully so). There is NO WAY that Dunn gets anywhere NEAR $10 Million per year
by GoBabies!! on Feb 2, 2009 12:42 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
And for the record
If he IS signed for that low, I hope we take a flier on him, but I’ll not be saddened AT ALL if we don’t.
by GoBabies!! on Feb 2, 2009 12:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If he signs a one-year deal, it will definitely be for more than that
If he signs a one-year deal, it will likely be for $8-11M. If he signs a 2-year deal, it will likely be for $14-20M total. At least that’s my prediction at this point. We’ll see if it comes true.
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why not
What terms and stakes do you propose?
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 7:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm putting up a betting post !!!
I don't know how to put this but I'm kind of a big deal.
by kcscoliny on Feb 2, 2009 7:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd also like for the Royals to have signed Teixeira
Hey, it’s Glass’s money. He should have spent it on Tex, and CC too.
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 1:31 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
That would have been great!
There is a difference between signing Dunn and signing Teixeira. Dunn looks like he is going to sign for a surprisingly low figure. The deal Teixeira got was more or less what everyone expected this time last year. Dunn would be a “bargin” so to speak.
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by James Quinn on Feb 2, 2009 2:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, Dunn would be a pretty good bargain
Of course I do want to point out that in addition to his plus bat, you also have to take into account his minus defense. His horrendous defense really limits his value. But he’s still a pretty good player. Maybe 2.5 WAR in 2009 and then it is hard to say when his decline will start. Players with his skill set and statistical profile typically decline early (see Hafner, Sexson). So I’d greatly prefer a 2-year deal to a 3-year deal.
But my point was that I’d love for the Royals to spend a lot more money than the current $75M(ish) payroll, but it’s pretty clear that they aren’t doing that this year. Maybe Glass should, but dealing with the reality, the Royals are very likely tapped out.
Now, if the Royals could go back in time and re-do the offseason, signing Dunn, Burrell, Furcal or Bradley would have been much better than acquiring a bunch of below average or replacement level players for more total money. But we are where we are, and Glass isn’t willing to push the payroll up to $85M this year.
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 3:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
and 2.5 is really optimistic (as you imply). Dunn’s defense is so bad that he’s in the DH penatly from the get-go, so his value over replacement is basically his lwts above average. CHONE’s context neutral numers have him at +16/150… now, that’s more pessimistic than some other stuff I’ve seen, but it isn’t too harsh. In addition to the “old player skills” issue, he’s been hitting in a league with inferior pitching, and in parks that exaggerate his (nonetheless impressive) power.
If that’s really his value (and it might be a bit higher because he usually plays mor ethan 150 a year, but I wouldn’t count on that), I’d say something like $1/8 or 2/$13 are fair.
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by devil_fingers on Feb 2, 2009 3:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd go 2/14!
Out of curiosity, does Dunn’s WAR go up by much if he’s a full-time DH? Even if it doesn’t (and I get the feeling that it doesn’t), given the Royals particular needs (i.e., good hitting) I think he’d have significant value to the Royals in that role, if a full-time DH role were available.
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 3:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I was estimating it as a full-time DH
It depends on where you thikn his defense is. I think, once you take range + arm + position into account, he’s at about -22.5 field + pos, the same as the DH penalty.
As an aside, that’s his “true” value. Tango says that when evaluating a player in terms of contract money or whatever, the valuatino of field + pos can never be below -22.5, since the team should be DHing the player. Justin’s rankings work that way for example. While I agree that it’s true, for a retrospective look at what the player has done, you have to show exactly what he was worth in terms of win value, which is what Fangraphs does.
Anyway, that’s (a rathaer poor) explanation of the basis for saying that for no-field all-hit guys, their runs/wins above average = runs/wins above replacement.
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by devil_fingers on Feb 2, 2009 9:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Don't we need a SS more?
Wouldn’t our money be better spent on improving the SS position? Who is left in FA at SS? Move Aviles to 2nd and jettison all but one or two of the 2nd base/utility guys.
We’d spend less on this and probably get a better upgrade. And not clutter the OF or 1B with another no defense, big stick, high strikeout guy.
If we are going to drop a few more million on a one or two year stop gap in a down market, I think that’s a good idea. Dunn is just the wrong target.
by Big Guy on Feb 2, 2009 3:54 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Orlando Hudson at 2B? Orlando Cabrera at SS?
Can’t afford Hudson anymore than Dunn. I’d rather develop and evaluate Callaspo (or even Teahen) at 2B than sign Cabrera as a place filler even at a bargain price. The Royals won’t be contending in 2009, so it doesn’t make sense to sign a space filler at a position where you’ve got a decent, young player with upside potential. And Cabrera would cost the Royals a second round draft pick.
And the rest of the remaining middle IF FA options are worse.
The immoderate moderator
by NYRoyal on Feb 2, 2009 4:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think they need to rework the FA compensation system a bit
it’s good to compensate teams who lose players, and to “penalize” teams who sign many free agents, but when FAs themselves are being hurt in the market, as is clearly the case with guys like Hudson and Cabrera, things are going wrong.
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by devil_fingers on Feb 2, 2009 9:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs














