(Possibly) the 239 Greatest Single-Season Offensive Performances in Royals History, 1969-2008
Given the Royals' recent struggles, I thought it might be nice to revisit some better times. So, in the continuing series of me learning about sabermetrics in order to prove that anyone can, here is an attempt at ranking the 239 Most Valuable KC Royals Individual Offensive Seasons (minimum 440 PAs) so that I can horn in on RoyalsRetro's historical coattails...
*** WARNING: TOTALLY MADE UP STATS AND NUMBERS BELOW. IF YOU DO NOT WISH TO BE INFECTED BY THEM, AVERT YOUR EYES IMMEDIATELY. IF YOU FEEL ANY ITCHING, CONFUSION, DISCOMFORT, OR BELIEF IN HELIOCENTRISM, YOU ARE URGED TO WASH YOUR EYES WITH COLD WATER, TURN ON BASEBALL TONIGHT, AND PERHAPS TO BUY A NEW COMPUTER IN CASE YOURS HAS BEEN INFECTED WITH THE MADE UP STAT VIRUS. ***
One way to think of this is as a companion piece to the one I did on (maybe) the 182 Most Valuable Individual Seasons by Royals Starting Pitchers, and, like that list, it will be open to revision as a refine my methodology, learn more, change my mind, etc. I feel pretty good about it so far -- I've been wanting to do this for a while, but it was only in the course of doing my series on the Myth of the RBI Guy at Driveline (Part One, Part Two, Historical Appendix) that I took care of some of the rough edges.
Sometimes I go on too long about methodological issues. Rather than doing that here, I'll simply recommend the first part of the aforementioned Driveline series for a lot of the more technical details. I'll have some short explanations of the numbers below.
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Not a lot of surprises on that first sheet, I suppose here. Note that the minimum numbers of PAs I used for a season was 440 -- not enough to qualify, but I wanted to see where Mike Aviles' 2008 ranked. To go much lower would have filled up the bottom end of the list with a bunch of seasons no one cares about. If you have a specific question about a specific player's season, feel free to ask.
Brief (for me) explanations:
The numbers on the right hand side of the sheet(s) will be familiar to you and are there for convenience of comparison. However, as was pointed out in NYRoyals helpful primer on offensive stats, while OBP and OPS are improvements on BA, BA w/ RisP, and even GWRBI (~!), none of of them give a complete picture of a playre's offensive contribution per PA. That's where wOBA (weighted on-base average) comes in. It take the average run value per plate appearance that the player contributes (according to linear weights) and converts it to a scale that approxiamtes OBP -- so we know that, in general, something around .330 is an average hitter, .300 is a bad hitter, .350 is above average, .400 is awesome, etc. While the rankings here are not done by wOBA directly, it is there because it gives a general "rate" number that some might feel more comfortable with as far as getting a picture of how a guy hit (it also includes stolen bases in this version).
Well, that wasn't brief... this will be. The next column over is "BRC," Batting Runs Created. Using the event-run values of that season, this is the "absolute" number of runs created by the player. Neither this nor the wOBA column are park-adjusted. The next two columns are the most important, for our puposes. BRAA (the blue colulmn) is Batting Runs Above Average, the number of runs created above what an average player would have created in the same number of plate appearances. I feel like this is a better way to rank hitters historically because it takes into account the run environment of the league, as we'll see. This number is park adjusted using terpsfans' five-year, regressed park factors. Finally, the rankings are done by BWAA, Batting Wins Above Average (the yellow column). Without getting into the theories about runs-to-wins conversion, I'll simply note that in less offensively prolific eras, it takes less marginal runs to generate a win, so this further tailors the rankings to the run environment of the time.
Note that this is just a ranking of offensive seasons by straight-up offense above average, which is related to, but only part of total player value. Let's not worry about positions, defense, baserunning, etc., and just talk some great (and not-so-great) Royals offense.
On to the Rankings
Going back to the All-Time Sheet of the ranks the (holding up three fingers) 239 KC offensive seasons with at least 440 PAs, here is the SHOCKING Top Ten:
| Rank | Name | Year | PA | wOBA | BRC | BRAA | BWAA |
| 1 | George Brett | 1980 | 515 | .480 | 121.86 | 63.87 | 6.53 |
| 2 | George Brett | 1985 | 665 | .433 | 137.00 | 60.50 | 6.11 |
| 3 | John Mayberry | 1975 | 682 | .427 | 130.33 | 52.50 | 5.54 |
| 4 | John Mayberry | 1972 | 587 | .401 | 99.07 | 41.19 | 5.01 |
| 5 | Danny Tartabull | 1991 | 557 | .430 | 111.92 | 48.41 | 4.48 |
| 6 | George Brett | 1988 | 681 | .394 | 117.92 | 42.95 | 4.48 |
| 7 | Hal McRae | 1982 | 675 | .396 | 117.79 | 41.57 | 4.27 |
| 8 | George Brett | 1979 | 700 | .402 | 125.85 | 41.64 | 4.13 |
| 9 | John Mayberry | 1973 | 638 | .401 | 111.55 | 38.61 | 4.08 |
| 10 | Danny Tartabull | 1987 | 667 | .400 | 124.43 | 41.95 | 4.02 |
Once you recover from the shock of my revolutionary revision of the received wisdom regarding Royals hitters history... yeah...Seriously, what is there to say about this? I'm sure it's been remarked upon many times, but the maybe the most amazing thing about 1980 is that Judge Smails George Brett put up those 6.53 wins (above average) in only 515 PAs. For perspective, only one player in all of baseball had a better year than that last season -- Albert Pujols. Pujols had a monster 6.98 BWAA season according to my numbers. But he did it in more than 100 more plate appearances (641,.458 wOBA) than Brett did in 1980. I wish I had heard something about Danny Tartabull that didn't involve him being a jerk...
Peruse the All-Time list for more "artifacts." Avilanche's 2008 comes in at #93 with 1.17 BWAA, right behind Matt Stairs' 1.18 in 2005.. Kevin Seitzer's 1987 comes in at #20 with 3.33. Yes, that's very good, despite not holding up to the awesome performances above. The highest ranking of a current Royals is David DeJesus's 1.28 BWAA 2008 (#86). Mark Teahen's 2006 just misses the cut by only being 437 PA, but he would have been right next to Raul Ibanez's 2002 (#62) with 1.68 BWAA.
We all know George Brett was a great hitter, though, so I did a "non-Brett" list as well. Here are the Top Ten non-Brett single season performances.
| Rank | Name | Year | PA | wOBA | BRC | BRAA | BWAA |
| 1 | John Mayberry | 1975 | 682 | .427 | 130.33 | 52.50 | 5.54 |
| 2 | John Mayberry | 1972 | 587 | .401 | 99.07 | 41.19 | 5.01 |
| 3 | Danny Tartabull | 1991 | 557 | .430 | 111.92 | 48.41 | 4.97 |
| 4 | Hal McRae | 1982 | 675 | .396 | 117.79 | 41.57 | 4.27 |
| 5 | John Mayberry | 1973 | 638 | .401 | 111.55 | 38.61 | 4.08 |
| 6 | Danny Tartabull | 1987 | 667 | .400 | 124.43 | 41.95 | 4.02 |
| 7 | Hal McRae | 1976 | 607 | .395 | 100.49 | 34.89 | 3.88 |
| 8 | Amos Otis | 1978 | 566 | .405 | 99.58 | 36.34 | 3.88 |
| 9 | Darrell Porter | 1979 | 675 | .398 | 119.44 | 38.24 | 3.79 |
| 10 | Danny Tartabull | 1988 | 593 | .387 | 99.55 | 34.27 | 3.57 |
John Mayberry could hit the ball as hard as he could the bottle, apparently. Amos Otis only appearing once on this list and not in the Top Ten overall obscures the fact that he was a good defensive center fielder, and thus one of the greatest Royals positoin players of all time. Beltran has had the better career, but Otis was the greater Royal (and, yes, that really meant something when Otis played). Otis' 1978 was something special.
This is meant to be an uplifting post, and I think it still can be, but it's understandablly depressing that the latest year on either top 10 is Tartabull's 1991. The Royals Universe revolves around George Brett, so let's use his retirement as another historical marker:
| Rank | Name | Year | PA | wOBA | BRC | BRAA | BWAA |
| 1 | Mike Sweeney | 2002 | 545 | .412 | 105.27 | 35.13 | 3.42 |
| 2 | Carlos Beltran | 2003 | 602 | .402 | 112.25 | 33.17 | 3.19 |
| 3 | Mike Sweeney | 2000 | 717 | .401 | 133.69 | 34.58 | 3.14 |
| 4 | Jermaine Dye | 2000 | 679 | .403 | 127.69 | 33.84 | 3.07 |
| 5 | Jose Offerman | 1998 | 707 | .382 | 118.39 | 28.96 | 2.73 |
| 6 | Carlos Beltran | 2001 | 679 | .383 | 117.71 | 27.36 | 2.64 |
| 7 | Mike Sweeney | 1999 | 643 | .396 | 115.48 | 28.51 | 2.60 |
| 8 | Mike Sweeney | 2001 | 631 | .384 | 109.88 | 25.92 | 2.50 |
| 9 | Johnny Damon | 2000 | 733 | .386 | 126.92 | 25.60 | 2.33 |
| 10 | Chili Davis | 1997 | 567 | .382 | 94.09 | 23.88 | 2.28 |
Yes, the decline of the franchise is clear, but I also want to emphasize that these are not "bad" hitters by any stretch of the imagination. No, Sweeney wasn't as awesome as some (including management) thought at the time, but to blame the club's best players for its failures is as foolhardy as it is common. If one Sweeny, Beltran, and Dye could have pitched... I was never a Sweeney basher, I don't think, but I also probably didn't appreciate him enough while he was around. In a rare non-ironic moment, royalsreview put it well:
Considering how much Royals fans have invested in either fleeting performances, like Bo Jackson, or ones that weren't actually that good, like Frank White, it would be a shame if Sweeney's decline dimmed our memories of how good he actually was. Even when we factor in his lack of defense and base-running, neither of which was always a total loss, Mike Sweeney is without question one of the top five position players in team history and the closest thing the Royals have had to Brett since 1993. For a player whose career spanned the darkest era in team history, Mike Sweeney is a player who should be remembered.
Leave it to Jose Offerman to taint this list; "sometimes jerks are just jerks," indeed. Jermaine Dye... I feel sad for you, kiddo. If only Chili could have stuck around another year and bumped Johnny Damon off of this list. Either that or Jeremy Giambi could have fulfilled his potential and done the same...
I suppose this exercuse wouldn't be complete without returning to the master list and listing the 10 worst performances of all time.
| Rank | Name | Year | PA | wOBA | BRC | BRAA | BWAA |
| 230 |
Brian McRae | 1992 | 585 | .277 | 46.97 | -18.35 | -1.93 |
| 231 | Frank White | 1976 | 471 | .264 | 33.36 | -17.54 | -1.95 |
| 232 |
Frank White | 1988 | 568 | .266 | 42.98 | -19.55 | -2.04 |
| 233 |
Jackie Hernandez | 1969 | 546 | .264 | 39.37 | -19.35 | -2.12 |
| 234 |
Tony Pena | 2007 | 528 | .276 | 41.88 | -23.63 | -2.29 |
| 235 |
David Howard | 1996 | 468 | .268 | 34.35 | -26.26 | -2.36 |
| 236 |
Rey Sanchez | 2000 | 544 | .289 | 48.24 | -26.96 | -2.45 |
| 237 |
Jose Lind | 1993 | 451 | .252 | 27.44 | -28.32 | -2.80 |
| 238 |
Angel Berroa | 2006 | 494 | .258 | 31.93 | -30.30 | -2.91 |
| 239 |
Neifi Perez | 2002 | 580 | .243 | 30.64 | .44.00 | -4.28 |
Royals trivia: Brian and Hal McRae are the only father-son team to make tables in this post. Bad seasons from Frank White sort of book-ending an otherwise distinguished career . David Howard: the best athlete on the team! Seriously, anytime you hear about a guy being "the best athlete on the team," isn't that almost a cue that he has little to no baseball skill? In Angel Berroa's 2003 Rookie of the year campaign (#133 all-time!), he was 0.39 BWAA. As for Neifi... That trade has to be the low point of the Baird years, right? Heck of a career fluke offensive year for Tony Pena, Jr. He was even better than David Howard. In 2008, he was -2.93 BWAA... in just 233 PA.
That's all for now. If you have any questions about methodology, or want single-season or career numbers for any player that isn't listed or something, just let me know. I'll be revisiting this after the season for sure.
10 recs |
29 comments
Comments
I'm #235
suck it sanchez.
DH: Where's the party!
Danny: David Howard and Mike Sweeney! Go away! Guys, you're gonna wake up my Mom!
by David Howards Legacy on Jun 2, 2009 10:37 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Very nice
Ride my coattails all you want, this post was excellent.
Who was really the most valuable player in 1985 – Mattingly or Brett?
I remember Tartabull’s 1991 season. The team was out of it, but he was just on a tear in the second half – an OPS over 1.000 after the ASB. It was his only All-Star season and he awesome – 31 HR 100 RBI, a .593 SLG to lead the league – all in spacious Royals Stadium. It was also his contract year and everyone knew he was leaving KC. I still have no idea why we didn’t trade him to a contender. We did get draft compensation for him (Sherard Clinkscale and Jon Lieber).
Danny was a pretty underrated player here in KC. I guess he was overshadowed by Brett and Bo, and he was a crummy fielder and struck out a lot, and he constantly complained he was underpaid (and he was) but man could he hit for some power for a team that really needed power.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Jun 2, 2009 11:03 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
D'oh, just lost a long post
Anyway, I’ll just retype the stuff. I’ve always assumed Brett should have won the 1985 MVP simply because he was not just he better hitter, but played 3B. But maybe I was wrong about the hitting. So I ran the SQl for ther 1985 AL and here are the top 5 in Batting Wins Above Average:
5. Eddie Murray 4.17
4. Don Mattingly 4.81
3. Wade Boggs 5.65
2. George Brett 6.11
1. Rickey Henderson 6.25
Holy crap was my reaction… Not only was Mattingly not close to Brett, he wasn’t even close to being the best offensive player on his own team! But Rickey…
So now I go Rally’s database (I haven’t bought the sortable version yet, but I’m going to simply support his awesomely free stuff). Here’s the same five guys with everythign taken into consideration (his lwts are different than mine for various reasons, not a big deal, though)
5. Eddie Murray 6.3 WAR
4. Don Mattingly 6.4 WAR
3. George Brett 8.3 WAR
2. Wade Boggs 8.7 WAR
1. Rickey Henderson 10.3 WAR
WEll, that didn’t turn out like I thoguht it would, other than Brett clearly being more valuable than Boggs. Looks like I should have made a blog post out of this… Maybe I still will. NOt everyone will buy this way of determining the MVP, but, well, if you do…
The Boggs thing really shocks me, although it shouldn’t since (and this is uncomfortable), since Rally rates the “big five” 3Bs accordingly for their careers:
Mike Schmidt 106.5
Wade Boggs 92.3
George Brett 89.3
Eddie Matthews 81.3
Kevin Seitzer 27.7
For the curious, Pete Rose is just under Brett at 84.6
Now, this doesn’t take into account subjective adjustments, peak value, and the like… but, ugh, I’ve looked at those number before today. I guess I had accepted Schmidt > Brett pretty easily, and Boggs was a greater player than people remember, but still… I’ll let other bang that out.
No shame in “losing” to Rickey, though, who ranks #4 since 1955 behind Bonds, Mays, and Aaron on Rally’s list. 1985 was his best season, too (just beats out his 1990 season in Oakland).
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
by devil_fingers on Jun 2, 2009 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh yea
I’ve had some at BTF tell me that Rickey shoulda won in ’85, and the stats probably bear that out.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Jun 2, 2009 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who was really the most valuable player in 1985 – Mattingly or Brett?
Clearly, Don Denkinger.
Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.
by BillyMojo on Jun 2, 2009 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Awesome post, but I'd rec it for the warning/disclaimer alone
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jun 2, 2009 12:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
So even in Tony Pena's "good" season
he still had the 6th worst offensive season in KC Royals history.
Tremendous.
by Top Ramen on Jun 2, 2009 1:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
On the other hand...
He was still almost twice as “good” as Neifi in 02.
Pop-up Perez might be last on the list (by a wide margin), but I’m certain that he was #1 at hitting infield pop-ups with runners on third and less than 2 out! I’m soooo glad we gave him 580 PAs………and by “glad” I mean ashamed. How did he get more PAs than everyone at the bottom except BMac in 92?
Tension is the enemy. - Charlie Lau
by aHorseWithNoName on Jun 2, 2009 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Neifi's Dad wasn't a Royals legend
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
by devil_fingers on Jun 2, 2009 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Brett MVP 85
is one of my biggest pet peeves. Definitely more deserving than Mattingly, and if forced to choose among several other worthy candidates, such as Henderson, how could the East Coast bias not have noticed Brett’s performance the last week and a half of the season, with the division being basically on the line every game, and George hitting a key HR in like FIVE OR SIX games in a week?
Check out the boxscores on baseball-reference for the end of that season – Brett pretty much willed the team over the Angels and into the post season (along with the great starting pitching, of course)
Mr Glass, this is a pro sports team, not a retail store - run it like one!
by loyal2sdad on Jun 2, 2009 1:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
OK, here are the details:
It’s Sep 30th, the Royals trail Cal by 1 game with 7 games left, 4 against Cal, 3 against Oak. Royals end up taking 3 of 4 from Angels, then 2 straight from Oak, and because Cal lost again after the head to head, the division was clinched the next to last day.
In those 6 games, Brett went 9-20 with a 2B, 5 HRs, 4 BBs, a SF, 7 R, 11 RBI. That comes out to 450/520/1250
9/30 vs Cal: 1-3, 1R, 2 RBI. Homered to tie the game 1-1, hit SF to extend a 2-1 lead to 3-1. Royals win 3-1 and are tied for 1st
10/1 vs Cal: 1-3 + BB. Royals lose 4-2 and fall 1 GB
10/2 vs Cal: 3-4 with 3 RBIs. Hit 3 run HR in 1st and Royals won 4-0 and are tied for 1st
10/3 vs Cal: 1-3 with BB, 2 R and 1 RBI. Hit solo HR to extend 3-0 lead to 4-0, Royals win 4-1. Royals now +1 game with 3 to play.
10/4 vs Oak: 2-4 with run & 2 RBI. Hit solo HR in 7th to extend 3-2 lead to 4-2, which was final score. Cal loses, and Royals now +2 in the standings.
10/5 vs Oak: 1-3 with 2R & 2 RBI, + 2 BB. Started comeback from 4-0 deficit with 2 run HR in 6th. Scored tying run in 7th after drawing BB. Royals win in 10th, 5-4, to clinch division.
For my money, this was the best weeklong clutch performance I’ve ever seen. Combine that with his great numbers from the season, and you have the AL MVP.
Mr Glass, this is a pro sports team, not a retail store - run it like one!
by loyal2sdad on Jun 2, 2009 2:05 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Do all wins count equally over the season?
I mean, if Brett had exactly the same numbers, and actually he same performances even with respect to the standings, but had had this run at in April as opposed to September, would it still matter as much?
I’d say yes., That doesn’t dismiss “clutch” performance (as you seem to be arguing for here), just saying that it matters as mucn in April as is does in September.
Here’s the thing: I don’t believe in “clutch” as a repeatble skill — I believe there are clutch hits, performance, etc., but not clutch hitters/players.
Still, that’s a powerful argument for Brett the clutch hitter. In fact, there are numbers that can account for how much win probability a player adds (his offensive contributions at the late + leverage). That’s Win Probability. And if you want ot measure how much win probabiliity (WPA) he adds divorced fromt he actual event, you can subtract the two (WPA minus WPA/LI) and get a “clutch” number like Fangraphs does. I explain some of these things in the first part of this post.
With that in mind, let’s look at the Offensive Win Probability Leaderboards for the 1985 AL.
Now, as far as I know, WPA is only recorded for batters and pitchers correct me if I’m wrong). So a guy who steals a lot of bases is going to get shafted on this…. Like Rickey. But let’s leave that aside.
We see that Brett is ahead of both Boggs and Henderson (aned Mattingly, I guess, but I think that issue has been settled) in WPA and Clutch. He’s 1.5 Wins ahead of Mattingly in WPA, which more than makes up the difference between them in traditional linear weights. He’s about 0.9 Wins ahead of Rickey… which closes the gap offensively, but not overall (and remember that Rickey may not be getting credit for the WPA his steals add). Brett has a 0.16 clutch rating, while Rickey and Boggs are both negative.
Still… maybe you want to just give credit to these guys as hitters re: WPA, maybe we don’t believe fielding differents are all that big… So Brett is MVP, right? Well, if you looked at the leaderboards, you know this is wrong. Eddie Murray had a 6.36 WPA as opposed to Brett’s 5.96… Moreover, if you thought Brett was good in the clutch with a 0.16… Murray’s “Clutch” stats is 2.89. That’s two wins added by him being a “Clutch” performer, and the difference is more than their difference in WAR… So, unless you think September clutch performances counts “more” than April cluthc performances or something (I haven’t looked at Murray’s Game Logs), then you have to say Murray was more valuable to his team than Brett (unless you want to penalize Murray for being on an inferior team… is Zack less valuable as a pitcher if the Royals aren’t contenders this season?).
Or you can reject the clutch issue, and then Henderson surely, and perhaps Boggs are more valuable.
Just food for thought.
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
by devil_fingers on Jun 2, 2009 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
a couple of factors that might qualify these games as "clutch"
they are somewhat intertwined (but what isn’t, really?) and a bit abstract, but i dislike the idea that a generic April game has the same importance as a do-or-die September game
first, quality of competition. the Angels were a stronger opponent than the “average” April opponent (now i don’t know that for a fact, but it stands to reason that the team essentially tied for first in the division is better than the average of the rest of the teams the Royals played). granted if we’re talking about Brett’s hitting, this really only should include the Angels’ pitching quality. my point is that it should matter if a player increases his performance against a higher-quality opponent.
second, for these games the Angels and Royals (and maybe the A’s, I don’t know if their season was de facto over at that point or not), were pulling out all the stops, i.e. they aren’t saving relievers for the next week or keeping pitch counts down (not that they did that back then anyway). my point is that in the normal course of the season, hitters would see the average pitching staff of a team, whereas in this end-of-season situation the hitters would see the top quality starters and relievers the Angels/Royals could muster. naturally this takes some assumptions, one that the teams actually adopt this coaching philosophy and two that if they did adopt this philosophy it would actually change the quality of the pitching compared to if it were any other game.
now, i’m not saying that a player producing better numbers under these circumstances is necessarily anything more than coincidence, but i am saying that performance under these circumstances should be valued more than performance under the average circumstances.
by benfunke on Jun 2, 2009 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There is a huge bias for players on teams that make the Post Season
They get ~15% more votes than those that don’t
by Jeff Zimmerman (TucsonRoyal) on Jun 2, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Brett could not parlay that into a deserved win over Mattingly
Wonder what the % bias is for East coast, big market teams. (esp. the Yankees)
Is it safe?
by KHAZAD on Jun 2, 2009 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Royals fans should really look at the 1979 MVP Race...
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
by devil_fingers on Jun 2, 2009 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Won by Don Baylor...
and the vote wasn’t close (at least he wasn’t a full time DH yet). It was all about the RBIzzzzz back then. Sucked to be Fred Lynn (4th) – he didn’t even get a first place vote…….
Brett 3rd, Porter 9th, and Buddy Bell (with his .778 OPS) was 10th (just 4 pts. back of Porter)!?!
Tension is the enemy. - Charlie Lau
by aHorseWithNoName on Jun 2, 2009 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yikes
Baylor shouldn’t even have been in the discussion. 4.6 WAR. Buddy Bell actually had a monster year with the glove that season (+31 runs), at 7.2 WAR overall. Rally has LLynn at 8.7, and Brett at 9.1 Porter is at 8.7, as well.
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
by devil_fingers on Jun 2, 2009 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah,
I forget sometimes how very good Bell was with the glove…
Not mentioned in my previous post, the rest of the top ten – Singleton 2nd (not sure why), Rice 5th (probably taking some votes from his teammate Lynn), Mike Flanagan 6th (top pitcher 23-9), Gorman Thomas 7th (only hit .244 but he DID have 45HR and 122 RBIzzz), and Bobby Grich 8th (2b that hit 30HR with 101 RBIzzz).
Tension is the enemy. - Charlie Lau
by aHorseWithNoName on Jun 2, 2009 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Grich was a great player
probably should be i nthe HoF (although he won’t ever be), but that year he was merely outstanding. Low Batting average hurts him -i stud defender, lots of walks, lots of power. Basically, he was Alberto Callaspo, but the very opposite.
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
by devil_fingers on Jun 2, 2009 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Grich = seriously underrated player
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Jun 3, 2009 8:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good and interesting post
I tried to name the top 5 without looking, and got 4 of them. For some reason, the bottom part made me laugh the most. I actually stopped going to games in 02 because I could not watch Neifi anymore. I was shocked that 3 others finished below David (The best athlete on the team) Howard’s 96, but I do remember that Rey Sanchez hit nearly every ball to the right field side during his worst year.
Question: Are there any players with less plate appearances who would have made the top 50 or bottom 50? It would take a really good (or bad) season to do it. How much below average were TPJ 08, or Larue 07 for example.
Is it safe?
by KHAZAD on Jun 2, 2009 7:20 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Thanks
When I revisit after the season (I’ll also redo the pitchers) with (hopefully) updated weights (just personal preference, I think these are actually pretty good), I’ll make it a more comprehensive list. I just wanted a good cutoff point.
As I listed it above, TPJ was -2.93 in 2008 in 233 PA.
Opening up the database…. LaRue was -1.46 in 2007. Reggie Sanders (~!) led that team with 0.44 in 85 PA… of course, with that few PA, you get a few homers or whatever and you look great.
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
by devil_fingers on Jun 2, 2009 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also
Wondering what the win difference would be between a year and a half of Dye and Perez after the trade. That has to be one of the worst trades ever. Of course the Rockies got Dye for nothing and then traded him for almost nothing.
Is it safe?
by KHAZAD on Jun 2, 2009 7:37 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Someone Remind Me
Again why we traded Mayberry.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Jun 3, 2009 2:04 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
wasn't it because he showed up severely hung over for a 1977 playoff game?
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
by devil_fingers on Jun 3, 2009 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep
Dropped a foul pop up and struck out three times or something like that. Whitey immediately demanded he be dealt and went public, which kind of forced the hand of Cedric Tallis (or was it Joe Burke by then?) We had to endure two years of light hitting Pete LaCock at first while Big John hit 20 homers a year for Toronto.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Jun 3, 2009 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It Must Have
Been game 4; 2 K’s in 2 AB’s, 2 errors, pulled for John Wathan.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/KCA/KCA197710080.shtml
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Jun 6, 2009 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs


















