The Five Least Valuable Position Players in the American League at the Moment According to WAR (FanGraphs)

Vernon Wells -1.3
Orlando Cabrera -0.9
Jose Guillen -0.9
Yuniesky Betancourt -0.8
David Ortiz -0.5

4 months ago devil_fingers 33 comments 0 recs |

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I saw the headline and I expected to see at least 2 Royals on the list

isn’t very fair to Ortiz as he has only started about 5 games at 1B. He is a DH all the way.

by AxDxMx on Jun 30, 2009 4:37 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

That should say "#5" isn't very fair

by AxDxMx on Jun 30, 2009 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

jacobs is +10

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

by devil_fingers on Jun 30, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

make that NUMBER 10 out of the worst

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

by devil_fingers on Jun 30, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

wow it's a big jump at fifth from the bottom...

how much higher up the list do you have to go to find guys with WAR of 1.8?

(as in how much higher up do you have to go to find someone with a WAR that is twice as good as Hoagie’s?)

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 4:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

oops my bad

those are negatives aren’t they.

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

by devil_fingers on Jun 30, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

so when they are negative numbers I should

consider them WBR or ‘Wins Below Replacement’

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

sort of confusing

the list is from worst to “best.” Keep in mind that WAR is a relative rather than “absolute” measure — that is, it doesn’t go from 0, but from a certain level below average per PA/games played.

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

by devil_fingers on Jun 30, 2009 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

so if Hoagie was actually -1.0, then

over the course of a season he would be the cause of 1.0 losses (which translates to 1.0 fewer wins) but either way one more loss over the course of a season than the comparatively “average” guy with a WAR of 0.0 who would have made your record say at the end of the season 81-81 vs. Hogie making your record 80-82

confusion is my normal state, just on the border between MO and KS.

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

almost

it means -1.0 is -1.0 below replacement so far this season

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

by devil_fingers on Jun 30, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

ah!

I was looking at it over the course of the whole season but that’s not the case. It’s not as bad then as I was thinking, since we still have over half the season to play and get better.

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Or

Couldn’t it be worse because that number could up worse?

If you were thinking, you wouldn't have thought that.

by Warden11 on Jun 30, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah i forgot the "sarc" font for the

I was thinking, since we still have over half the season to play and get better

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

BUT if this were 'end of the season' WAR numbers,

I’m getting the picture of how it works?

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah

it’s relative to an idealized “replacement player,” who, over a full season, is about 2 wins below an average player.

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

by devil_fingers on Jun 30, 2009 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

so at this point if Hoagie continues the same pace, he's about

one loss better than a replacement player and one loss worse than an average player.

gee whichever way you look at it, he sucks.

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

um, no

right now, he’s one win (or loss, whichever), than a replacement player.

At this pace, by the end of the season, he’ll be about two wins worse than a replacement player, and about )four) wins worse than an average player.

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

by devil_fingers on Jun 30, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not to mention 11.6 million on top of being -4 million worse then not playing him.

so Jose is approaching -15 million loss for the Royals. OW.

er, so far this season. But at this pace will get up to about -60 million for this season and next. Of course, that doesn’t have take into accoutant decline, so its most likely worse then that, say -65 million.

Go Royals!

by BabyBlues on Jul 1, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

But you really can't blame Dayton Moore for wanting to win now!

/Mellinger

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

by devil_fingers on Jul 1, 2009 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

and if a guy had a WAR of +1.8 (let's say +2.0 vs -1.0)

he’d be attributed with (holds up three fingers) THREE more wins (hiccup) so your record would be 84-78 (burp) with that guy and still (hiccup) 80-82 with Hoagie ..

interesting.

-George Brett

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

no George you're drunk. That would be 83-79 vs. 80-82

but you’re getting the picture. Go hit some golf balls and have some more Iced Teas.

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah (hic) whatever, Billy, nobody (hic) is calling YOU to be a General Manager

and do you know why? DO YOU KNOW WHY? because sometimes you just don’t know what you’re talking about

-George Brett

Yeah? From what I hear, you couldn't hit water if you fell out of a f@#%ing boat.

by BillyMojo on Jun 30, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Mike Jacobs is tenth

Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com

by RoyalsRetro on Jun 30, 2009 4:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I bet Dayton is still pissed...

the Mariners wouldn’t take Butler off our hands or we would have # 4 as well.

by djk royal on Jun 30, 2009 5:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Ben Francisco is 6th

We shoulda jumped on him for Teahen when we had the chance.

Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com

by RoyalsRetro on Jun 30, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wow...thats some highly paid shit....

and we thought the Jogui contract was bad….imagine being on the hook for Wells’ deal

Fire Everyone

by billybeingbilly on Jun 30, 2009 5:50 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

yeah, I was planning on doing a writeup of that before allthe trades started happening

I was actually talking to someone yesterday who said that wasn’t J.P.’s call, actually, that the Team Pres. and Owner insisted that Wells be resigned.

Yeah, he’s been worse than expected since the signing, but it was reasonable to expect him to be a ~4WAR player in 2008 (when the deal started). Too bad they paid him like a 5 WAR player.

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

by devil_fingers on Jun 30, 2009 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

by devil_fingers on Jun 30, 2009 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

if he would have been 5 war

which he wasn’t. Unless you subscribe to the Dayton Moore “I bet he’ll replicate last year’s career year, but maybe do even better!” projection system

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

by devil_fingers on Jun 30, 2009 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs