Lunchtime Royals Links: Where Flyballs Carry the Best Edition
A few years ago, people began to speculate that sabermetrics was essentially over. Most of the essentially truths about the sport had been discovered and it was perhaps time to move on. Sure, there was the matter of the daily grind of the information wars, and it was clear that there was a visible generational divide between people who were open minded, and people who were personally invested in their own understanding of the game remaining king. Nevertheless, in terms of actual sabermetric research, there was a feeling around 2007 that there wasn't much left to discover or explore.
Then pitch f/x came out, and was, quite amazingly, publicly available. Now, we also have a version for hitters. Text and graphs heavy websites churning out incredible research are back again. Now all we need is usenet to return! Check out this post on where the ball carries the best, and worst.
We never know it all. The train keeps moving. (Which also means that the Royals FO isn't just going to stay out of date, they're going to get out of date in their out of dateness.)
- Gritty & Clutch: Billy Butler: One of These Things Is Like the Other...
- You Can Stop Making Your Royals Jokes, They're a Serious Club Now! - Walkoff Walk
26 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
I believe Nancy K. D. Lemon also moonlights as one of the Royals two sabermetricians
Best part about the “sabermetrics is over” thing is that the most famous expression of it was written by Gary Huckaby, former Baseball Prospectus writer who (I think still) works for the As.
Maybe he just meant “BP has nothing left to contribute,” which, given what’s happened since, turns out to be mostly true.
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
Hey, congrats on the new son
your life will never be the same. I have 3 boys (12, 5, and 18 months) and couldn’t be happier. Best of luck to you!
I’m glad to see Moustakas heating up, but Hosmer has been awful in Wilmington. I’m really curious to see how many of the BA top 100 we have and where we rank overall. DM’s doing the right things but if it doesn’t produce results then we need to get somebody else in there.
I am going to make a bold prediction-the Royals will be very near or even slightly over .500 next year. Besides the fact that I’m looking through powder-blue glasses, I expect the bullpen to get fixed next year. I also expect the offense to get significantly better with continued improvement from Gordon (I’m actually starting to get excited about him, he seems to be turning a corner) and continued improvement from Butler. I don’t know what to think about the defense, b/c it will be very dependent on what moves DM makes (and I know that he hasn’t inspired confidence lately) but I really think we’ve seen the last of Jose Guillen in the field, at least every day. The one area that I think we may not see great improvement is defensively at catcher. If we go with Pena, he helps our offense but he isn’t great on defense. I also think that we’re a little due, this season has been bad for a lot of legitimate reasons, but I also think that we’ve had some bad luck and some of that is due to change. You heard it here first!!!
Kansas City Royals - rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic since 1994.
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Aug 14, 2009 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions
thanks
I’m experiencing all the usual generic first time parent emotions: excitement, misplaced pride (look at my boy poop! that’s his thing!), fear, antciptation, love, etc. It’s surprisingly enjoyable.
I do think the Royals have a shot at .500 next season, but I’m not sure if they shoud, if you know what I mean.
As for the Royals… Well, my crude first-run projections that I skewed optimistically (no significant injuries, real improvement from Butler and Gordon, little decline from DDJ, etc) have them as almost exactly MLB average… except that they play in the AL, so that’s probably a ~76 win team. Even if I jack things up for “breakouts” by Butler and Gordon, let Teahen improve, let Jacobs and Guillen improve, etc., Farnsworth and Cruz being useful, Disco Hayes living up to our fantasies, Hoch and Banny being middle of the rotation guys, Meche returning to #2 status, Greinke being one of the top starters in baseball, etc. they still are barely over .500 in the AL, and that’s assuming not only that nothing goes wrong, but that everything goes more than “right.”
I’m not sure it’s worth it. Because they won’t be much better in 2011. That’s why they should have already been aggressively trying to move not only crap players like Mahay, Cruz, Olivo, Jacobs, etc., but also decent players like DDJ, Teahen, and Meche. for prospectus. I like those guys, but they simply aren’t going to be significant players in the next potential Royals contenders. But now I’m just repeating what others have said.
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Aug 14, 2009 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I would keep DDJ
I think he still has some real value. No way I bring back Teahen and the rest. I agree with you on Meche as well and have been banging that drum for a while.
I see what you’re saying about just trying to get to .500 not really being a worthwhile goal, but then if you get that far and then some of the prospects start to hit, we could be in business. But, that’s assuming that DM redeems himself and stops signing the Jacobs and Farnsworths of the world.
Kansas City Royals - rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic since 1994.
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Aug 14, 2009 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Both DDJ and Teahen have real value
but that’s why they should be traded — because they might bring somethign worthwhile back. Especially DDJ, who’s an above average player on a bench player’s contract.
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Aug 14, 2009 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Interesting article on FB carry
It seems that Colorado had a difficult time competing, for the reason that their home field required fast outfielders to cover the large distance, but also required power hitters, also necessary due to the high altitude. I always thought they had 2 alternatives: go with speedy, athletic outfielders without much power, and spend a larger percentage of their payroll on infield power, or try to get superstar outfielders who were both fast and powerful. Obviously, either method is very expensive – and arguably more difficult than assembling a good lineup in a normal park.
How does this relate to KC? Well, because our dimensions are so large, and yet the ball carries fairly well, KC is sorta in the same predicament as Colorado was – just not to as great of an extent. Moore seems to be trying to assemble speedy, non-power outfielders, which might work IF they could assemble a power hitting infield to keep them competitive on the road. Unfortunately, stud, power hitting middle infielders are among the rarest (and thus, most expensive) commodities in the game, and the Royals minors have been very poor at developing said commodities. Toss in the (so far) less-than-hoped-for power development of Butler/Gordon at the infield corners, and there you have it – failure.
Great link, RR – it got me thinking a lot about what type of team is needed to succeed in KC.
By the way, I’d love to see Devil Fingers thoughts on how this relates to potentially moving in the fences (again) in KC, etc., and whether that might make it easier/harder to assemble the type of players suited for one’s home ballpark.
Mr Glass, this is a pro sports team, not a retail store - run it like one!
I'm flattered anyone would care what I think!
I have to admit I don’t have the attention span to absorb the “carry” stuff right now,.
I will say that Brian Cartwright’s component park factors are very helpful (don’t know if they’re still avaiable for download, and/or if he’s going to update for the latest mods to the K), as they separate out not just by component, but by batter handedness.
They confirm what most would already suspect about the current K: it’s more like the “classic” K of the 70s and 80s — it is pretty neutral for run-scoring overall, while depressing HRs significantly and increasing hit rates on balls in play. So it’s going to slighlty favor hitting styles like DDJ’s and Butler’s, and be somewhat unfriendly to guys like Gordon (and very unfriendly to guys like Jacobs, as the K is even more unfriendlyto LH homer run hittesr than Dolphin stadium, especially ones who kinda stuck to begin with). That’s not meant as an explanation or excuse, just putting it out there. I don’t think it’s significant enough to say “wel, dump Gordon” or “resign Butler for 10 years” or anything, though.
Personally, I don’t think teams should go nuts about finding players to “suit their environment,” given that the other teams have to play there as well. It’s hard enough finding good players as it is, even for good GMs, and Dayton Moore is…. not good.
My “gut” instinct is that if you have to choose between a pitchers park and a hitters park, you’d want a pitchers park. It’s pure anecdotal, but I remember Barry Bonds saying he thought playing in big parks like Candlestick and SBC helped him really hone his hitting, since he knew he really had to wait for the right pitch to drive because he knew he’d really have to make solid contact (it also helps if you’re Barry Bonds, but you know what i mean). I also remember A-Rod saying he had to adjust moving out of GAB to New York because in Arlington you could “square up” less and still get some homers. Obviously, he digured it out enough to hit 48 jacks for NYA in 2005 and 54 in 2007, and, again, being A-Rod makes a difference.
Seems like having a hitters park, even like the pre-2004 K, can also mess with your young pitchers a bit too much.
As for players in particular, I think you just go with the best combination of offense and defense you can. So many “how to fix the Royals” articles I read say “they have to improve their offense so sign [slow slugger] for whatever he asks for!” or “we have to improve defense so move TEahen to first!” (Mellinger) without thinking about overall player value. Yes, a runs saved counts as much as one scored. But a run scored counts as one saved. The Royals defense would undoubtedly be much improved with an outfield of Paulo Orlando and Jose Duarte in place of Teahen and MITCH. But those guys would also hit like Willie Bloomquist (maybe!).
I do think defense, particularly outfield defense, is still undervalued relative to offense, but the window is closing for that (and the Royals aren’t even up to standard in the current market). Putting guys like DDJ, who are ~average defensive CFs, in the corner is a smart move anywhere — even if they have down years with the bat, or for the position, they more than make it up with defense. The “three CF outfield” isplaying to good results in Seattle, Tampa Bay, and elsewhere. I don’t think MITCH is a full-timer, but again, this would be true in most parks. That’s why is would have been good to get Ryan Langerhans when he was avaiable…
but now I’m rambling.
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Aug 14, 2009 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Here's Another Short
Story from Yahoo Sports that I didn’t see linked here.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ap-royals-owner&prov=ap&type=lgns
KANSAS CITY, Mo. (AP)—Owner David Glass says planned to meet with other team officials to discuss why the Kansas City Royals are in last place in the AL Central.
Glass tells The Associated Press he plans to become more involved the rest of the year.
Picked by many to compete this year, the Royals have been crippled by injuries, an anemic offense and ineffectiveness in the bullpen. They headed into a weekend series at Detroit with the second-worst record in the majors.
Manager Trey Hillman has come under fire from fans and the media. But Glass said Friday he has complete confidence in his general manager.
Now Treyton has gotten the dreaded vote of confidence. It’s never good when the owner wants to get more involved, especially in a disastrous season.
There is a comment on this story that essentially says speed is how the Royals won in the glory days, and that is mostly accurate. I think the easiest way for us to become competitive again is pitching, speed and defense. This style of ball might make a comeback overall with the end of the steroid era; power hitters are going to become harder to find and thus more expensive.
Chicks dig the long ball, but they also dig participation in an occasional pennant race.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
Block Quote Fail
The quote ends with Glass’s vote of confidence.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 14, 2009 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions
this spells only B.A.D.
unless it ends with wholesale dumpage of the FO, medical staff, and Mr. Hillman at end of year. Of course, if he continues to be an “involved” owner after a new staff comes in, it will make no difference and will still be BAD.
Hopes fade once again from blue to red. Go New Chiefs!!
The last sentence in the article was somewhat confusing
Manager Trey Hillman has come under fire from fans and the media. But Glass said Friday he has complete confidence in his general manager.
What does Trey Hillman coming under fire have to do with his confidence in DM?
I agree though, it’s never good when Glass says he wants to get more involved.
Unless I'm wrong...
My Twitter feed
Yeah, I Didn't
Read that closely enough. It could be just another vote of confidence for Trey and an incorrect reference to his job.
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 14, 2009 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions
or maybe if the GM has confidence in the coach then the coach should feel safe
"The life of a (Royals) fan must be lived forward but can only be understood backward" -- Kierkegaard (more or less)
Perhaps; Who Knows?
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 15, 2009 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah I'm Watching
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Aug 14, 2009 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks RR for Chukers link....
A name we should remember is Patrick Keating…. He will do just what Greg Holland did and move up to AAA in two seasons. I expect him to be in the Omaha bullpen by the end of 2011. Holland should be in our pen by the end of September. Unfortunately, other than Perez there isn’t much else at IDF that I see making it pass AA.
Wow, the Cubs are kicking butt today…..
sorry to say Holland prob won't be in KC bullpen by Sept
heard a rumor Holland separated his shoulder the other day and will more than likely be out for the remainder of the season. My source tells me he’s not on the road trip with the AAA, either. So, something must be up.
by baseballfandan on Aug 14, 2009 9:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Will...
with twinkie town reaching 1 million hits…i was just curious where we’re at? ahead? behind?
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Aug 14, 2009 5:12 PM EDT reply actions
The ball carrying stats..
Correlate pretty closely to what the average temperature would be on the playing field at the time of a game ( except Denver, of course and San Diego? ). Here is a case where statistical analysis backs up what we thought we knew intuitively.















