Bannister is on an island here and knows it. Most people within the game remain far more...

Bannister is on an island here and knows it. Most people within the game remain far more traditional in their evaluation tools.

"Wins and losses," pitching coach Bob McClure said. "It doesn’t tell you everything, but it all comes back to wins and losses."

KC Star

3 months ago Warden11 16 comments 0 recs |

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Read More: brian bannister, dark ages, royals

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McClure needs to go.

He can’t fix anyone in our bullpen. Believe me, I’ve watched him out there….

Coffee. The NEW Performance Enhancing drug for Sport's Writers. Just ask Ken Rosenthal.

by 306008 on Aug 2, 2009 9:55 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

He may not be able to polish turds

But he has done well with players that have some talent (Ram Ram, Zack, Gil…)

BOOM! ROASTED!

by GoBabies!! on Aug 2, 2009 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

funny how that works, out, huh

Cf. Seitzer, Kevin, “OMG FIRE SEITZ HE’S RUINED JACOBS!!!”

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

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by devil_fingers on Aug 2, 2009 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Little blurb in the Star this morning

quoted Banny as preferring xFIP as the best way to evaluate pitchers. I wonder if he’s trying to change the clubhouse environment slightly, or has to get his message out to the writers & fans, because he feels like an alien on this team.

by hunter s. royal on Aug 2, 2009 11:01 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

The very fact that what he has done has worked

should have the other pitchers with the Royals screaming for his help, including McClure. Banny has turned himself from one of the worst regulars last year, into better than league average. That’s a minor miracle.

Keep preaching Pitch-F/X and advanced stats Banny. We are with you!

by AxDxMx on Aug 2, 2009 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

McClure isn't the problem

but if he is talking about pitcher wins and losses, especially considering he has Zack on his staff, then he needs a reality check.

- W. Bloomquist homered to deep center
- P. Earth explodes

by JobDDT on Aug 2, 2009 11:51 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

there is a possibilty that they're talking about two different things....

xFIP may be the best way to evaluate how a pitcher is throwing….but W-L’s are still what it really comes down to….you dont make the playoffs simply bc you have a good xFIP and high wOBA…you make the playoffs bc you translate those things and luck….into wins.

Fire Everyone

by billybeingbilly on Aug 2, 2009 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Which, when your starter throws seven shutout innings,

still isn’t any help until your offense finally gets off their asses in the eighth.

This space for rent.

by jonfmorse on Aug 2, 2009 7:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

His Own Staff

Is the best example of why W/L is possibly the worst counting stat to use to evaluate a pitcher’s performance. McClure needs to hop on his Harley and ride back to 1965 where his wisdom will be appreciated.

I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.

by philofthenorth on Aug 2, 2009 11:57 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Meh, I don't mind that from a pitching coach

what’s the context? Obviously, W-L are the most important to the team, even if it’s a dumb way to evaluate pitchers.

Anyway, what would you expect? I’m care more about the results (to the extent they can be credited to/blamed on him) the coach gets than whatever “wisdom” he spouts to the papers.

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.

Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.

by devil_fingers on Aug 2, 2009 2:12 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

My God

Reporter: “So maybe this Sabermetics thing works, huh?”
McClure: “I don’t know about that… All’s I know is he pitched.”

—8/2/09 post-game interview

- W. Bloomquist homered to deep center
- P. Earth explodes

by JobDDT on Aug 2, 2009 4:52 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

And this is what irks me

This team just seems openly hostile to sabermetrics. McClure didn’t say, “you know, maybe it has helped, I’ll have to look into, I don’t really know enough about it. What I do know is that he’s changed his approach, yadda yadda yadda.” Instead they just seemed pleased as punch that they are ignorant.

Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com

by RoyalsRetro on Aug 3, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

In fairness

McClure may not have been referring to pitcher wins and losses, but the team. As in, “all that stuff is nice, but if it doesn’t translate into wins, it does us no good.”

This space for rent.

by jonfmorse on Aug 2, 2009 7:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Isn't that still idiotic though?

Why not say, those numbers really help to confirm that our starting pitchers are doing their job. We just have to put it together with other parts of the game to turn it into wins?

He can get 4, NOT 5.

by Warden11 on Aug 2, 2009 8:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'd suggest at that point

that Bob McClure’s the one guy in a management position with the club whose commentary on the “other parts of the game” is the most irrelevant, don’t you think? I mean, he could gripe about the offense or the collection of unreclaimable stiffs he’s been handed as a “bullpen”, but you really think he’s going to say anything like that?

McClure has been unable to do anything with bad pitchers, which just means he’s not a miracle worker; on the other hand, he’s helped make a few decent pitchers into pretty good ones. So, really, even if he is making a stupid-ass Baseball Luddite comment, I don’t particularly care.

This space for rent.

by jonfmorse on Aug 2, 2009 8:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs