Greinke Absolutely Brilliant Again As Royals Defeat Mariners
by Will McDonald on Aug 30, 2009 7:46 PM EDT
in News
84 comments
Zack Greinke is beyond words again, I'm happy to say. A complete game one-hitter, with five strikeouts and just one walk. Just such a feather in Dayton's cap to be able to say that he's the one that drafted this guy.
Suddenly the race for AL Cy Young got interesting again.
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You wanted to know why you still care
1) Once a team really sucks you in, you can’t get out. Even if they really suck.
2) Zack Greinke
Phase 1: Assemble expensive, below average players
Phase 2: ?
Phase 3: CHAMPIONSHIP!
-RoyalsRetro
by ratherfantastic on Aug 30, 2009 7:58 PM EDT reply actions
*
Phase 1: Assemble expensive, below average players
Phase 2: ?
Phase 3: CHAMPIONSHIP!
-RoyalsRetro
by ratherfantastic on Aug 30, 2009 8:54 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
BBTonight did a segment on Zack
They gushed over his change of speeds and locations, complimented him for staying strong while the Royals are “underwater,” and they dug up an obscure stat showing that the only pitchers who’ve ever followed a 15+ K game with a one-hitter were Zack, Pedro, Randy Johnson, and Vida Blue.
by swing and a miss on Aug 30, 2009 8:00 PM EDT reply actions
Does Greinke pull in extra fans
on the road or does the overall team suckage keep that from happening?
i doubt it
unless you become a multi-year legend, people don’t really attend games for the opposing SP
by Will McDonald on Aug 30, 2009 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions
There's a few of us that do
I specifically went to Kauffman to watch Rich Harden’s debut with the A’s. I went to watch Randy Johnson pitch several times as well (though he fits your legend theory). I will go to see someone with filthy stuff.
yeah, lots of people went last year to see Lincecum
some people did it for Felix Hernandez a few years ago
by Fernando Vina School of Linguistics on Aug 31, 2009 1:05 AM EDT up reply actions
Masterful
It wasn’t dominant in the traditional sense but the Mariners looked as helpless as I’ve ever seen a non-Royals lineup. Not only was I never concerned that they’d score a run, I was never concerned that they’d get on base. What a pleasure. It looked totally effortless.
by billexgordler on Aug 30, 2009 8:20 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Oh and that's not all
Royals record vs. Seattle in 2009: 5-4
Grass Creek is ours!!
Phase 1: Assemble expensive, below average players
Phase 2: ?
Phase 3: CHAMPIONSHIP!
-RoyalsRetro
by ratherfantastic on Aug 30, 2009 8:29 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
This was a dominating game
So much weak contact… they were flailing from the 4th inning on. Dismantled them
-
And if Mitch Maier makes a diving effort for that lone hit
We could be talking about a no-hitter.
Or we could be talking about that dumbass play he made that gave the Mariners an inside the park homer. Mariners win 2-0.
by AxDxMx on Aug 30, 2009 9:02 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Its hard to throw a no hitter
without a little bit of Defensive help. For the most park Greinke made things easy on the defense, and Maiers effort was the determining factor in whether there was to be a no no today. But the Royals have dogged it all series, can you expect any less?
Brilliant pitching today, I am proud to say I witnessed it first hand (and kept score)
by Mr. Weatherstone on Aug 30, 2009 10:18 PM EDT up reply actions
The Zack attack...
Not only did we finally win our 50th game just a day before the end of the month. We did it is convincing fashion. It was all Zack with a little (very little) help from the offense. He is the real deal and we need to build around him. I spent a great day watching the game on a 73 inch TV, eating way way too much, and celebrated the win with Crown Royal. A great day and a great win for the boys in Blue. Now lets take three from Oakland. 63 wins is doable…. Go Royals….
I'm still on the Bryce Harper train
The only games I want to win from here on out are Greinke’s starts. That alone would give him the Cy Young I think. As in, he’s so valuable, and such a one man wrecking crew that the only games the Royals could win in September were games he started.
I really getting tired of the Harper myth.
1. We probably wouldn’t be able to sign him ala Crow. 2. Knowing the luck of the Royals… he would turn out to be another Colt Griffin. 3. We let the Nationals pay the big bucks and a couple years later have him go to the Yankees. Tired of the name Harper….
please, ease up on drafting more high school hitters until the ones that have been drafted at least begin to look like they can develop.
they both look like they can develop.
Gimmenechristmas
Coffee. The NEW Performance Enhancing drug for Sport's Writers. Just ask Ken Rosenthal.
they haven't even played a minute of AA ball yet
20 homers and a good RBI numbers in High A could be meaningless in AA. Lets don’t annoint them just now.
I get the feeling that Zack decides before the game..............
how he wants to win the game. Strike-outs?….All off-speed?…1-hitter?…No problem, I’ll show these sons-a bitches.
When he knows his stuff is good
why not? He’s Zack Greinke dammit!
Phase 1: Assemble expensive, below average players
Phase 2: ?
Phase 3: CHAMPIONSHIP!
-RoyalsRetro
by ratherfantastic on Aug 30, 2009 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Why the Dayton cheap shot?
I mean, his FA decisions haven’t been the best but we’ll have to wait and see on his two drafts. We should see the first fruits next year, in which case the ungenerous can make some snap judgments and cheap shots? But we really can’t zap GMDM on his drafts until the end of 2011. – TL
are we not going to put drafting Hochevar #1 overall on Dayton?
I mean he wasn’t technically drafting but he definitely had something to say right?
I’m not saying I absolutely hate Luke as a player. I don’t, but considering his history/performance and our team need, there was no reason why the royals has to take him.
Mourning Guy Carbonneau...
Royals obscure player to watch in ST: Lenny DiNardo
by playingwithfire on Aug 30, 2009 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions
He took the credit when Luke was hot a while ago
After denying it before. Make of that what you will.
I wouldn't say that Hoch's value is...
…settled. He’s still a dynamic quantity—-not a bust nor a success yet. He’s shown flashes of brilliance, however, that bode well. So we’re back to my 2011 timeframe. – TL
Greinke used to suck too
Desperately hoping for Desperate Measures
by averagegatsby on Aug 31, 2009 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Greinke was by far the better prospect
and he wasn’t even #1 overall
Mourning Guy Carbonneau...
Royals obscure player to watch in ST: Lenny DiNardo
by playingwithfire on Aug 31, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions
fair enough...
but thats not to say that Hochevar wont come into his own.
Desperately hoping for Desperate Measures
by averagegatsby on Aug 31, 2009 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions
ZG is amazing!
I’m just worried about the next start as the trend following 2 amazing starts is a letdown…
Coffee. The NEW Performance Enhancing drug for Sport's Writers. Just ask Ken Rosenthal.
What wouldn't call it a letdown
No one is “really” this good, if you think about it. Meaning, Zack is “on” this season, and the last week and hte first couple months, in particular, but performance is always a combination of the players “true talent” at the time, in his run environment (park, league, offensive levels of the era, defense it he case of pitchers), and, yes, random variation (luck, good and bad). So a “letdown” on his next start doesn’t necessarily mean (and almost certainly doesn’t mean) he isn’t trying as hard or taking a night off or whatever. It’s just that no one is 15 Ks/one hitter good… but Zack also isn’t 1st start in TOR bad, either.
Make sense?
Zack is still on his way to a historic season.
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Aug 30, 2009 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions
RR,
let me first say thank you for all the time you put into this blog; I’m sure it takes a lot of time to do, seriously. It’s the first place I come every day and I think you do a great job.
Having said that, I do think you need to back off on the DM negativity a little bit, for no other reason than it hurts your credibility a little bit. You and a lot of other people hate DM, and depending on where this offseason goes, I’ll probably be right there with you guys.
However, why the shot about DM “drafting” Zack? Nobody ever said that DM drafted him, and nobody ever said that Allard Baird was a complete moron. Allard did do some good things, but the negatives also hugely outweighed those positives.
To me though, when we get the chance to celebrate one of the few bright spots of this season, why ruin it with a gratuitous shot at DM that’s totally irrelevant to the story at hand? Zack was masterful today, so let’s just leave it at that.
Just like Allard (and every other GM out there) DM has made a bunch of good moves, some “meh” moves and some downright shitty ones. If your point is that there was a lot more talent here than we would be led to believe initially, you’re absolutely right. But, Baird (and Glass is a BIG culprit in this, no doubt) ran this franchise into the ground and we were a laughingstock. As bad as this season has been, there have been a lot of positives that have occurred during Moore’s regime and we are much better off than we were three years ago.
Maybe I am more patient than most people on here, and my patience is starting to wear thin, too.
In any case, for today, anyway the story is that young man and the excellent game he pitched, not DM.
Kansas City Royals - rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic since 1994.
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Aug 30, 2009 10:33 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
+1
I would add that if we are writing off Hochevar, Moustakas, and Hosmer, then it is worth noting that Greinke didn’t look like such a great pick in 2005-2006. Let’s give them time before writing off those drafts.
by jbrocato on Aug 30, 2009 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
to be fair
Hooch was not DM’s pick, but yeah you’re right. i do think it’s got to turn around fairly quickly. i actually prefer the HS route, truth be told but it takes longer…Smoak, Wieters and Longoria sure would look good in Royal blue right about now…
Kansas City Royals - rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic since 1994.
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Aug 30, 2009 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions
With all the stories that have been coming out this year...
It seems like Allard Baird was not the fault of Allard Baird. I can’t say for sure that Glass is mucking up Dayton’s time, but it wouldn’t surprise me if he was. Though, I’m pretty sure Dayton is doing this all on his own. This is the team DM wanted afterall.
Moore's PR campaign the last few weeks really annoyed me
“I do want to make one more point….We have five homegrown players on our team. And that is why this is continually to look broke at the major league level. Until we’ve got sixty percent of our 25 man roster is homegrown and until 75-80% of our 40-man roster is homegrown, it’s going to be a difficult challenge.”
yea, and those players are carrying this team, to say nothing of the homegrown guys he dealt away in pretty bad trades, like JP howell
by Will McDonald on Aug 31, 2009 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions
I want to like GMDM...
but he is really making it hard… I get that a large base of Royals fans are simple and will buy into his propaganda, but I get highly offended when my intelligence (and I would imagine most of the people here are the same way) is challenged.
The reason I stopped checking the RoyalBoard was when someone told me that Trey Hillman has forgotten more about baseball then I will ever know, Im not sure that is even possible. I get that Im not the most knowledgeable baseball fan, but I make a pretty good effort to educate myself. And the fact that GMDM shows disdain for the “new” stuff is preposterous to me. When has intelligence and advanced metrics ever been a bad thing when applied to anything else? Hell even Home Fucking Depot grades their cashiers on 10 metrics, most of which I doubt I could never guess.
Desperately hoping for Desperate Measures
by averagegatsby on Aug 31, 2009 12:27 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
My love of GMDM is kinda like what Brian Posehn said of George Lucas's "new trilogy"
Basically the joke is, that episode 1 was like an uncle you’ve liked your whole life trying to put his penis in your mouth while you were in that state of about to sleep after eating christmas dinner, only for you to freak out. Then when Episode 2 came out it was like Christmas 2 years later and you forget all about it because nothing like that had ever happened before and nothing had happened since, but sure enough you start to fall asleep and it happens again.
Well with GMDM I really hope he doesn’t slip his penis in our mouths a second time by trading for Vernon Wells, signing Vladamir Guerrero (7 years too late) and picking up Russ Ortiz.
Desperately hoping for Desperate Measures
by averagegatsby on Aug 31, 2009 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
It has been foretold, and soon shall it come to pass
Vernon Wells will be your new CFer in 2010 when JP Ricciardi firesales the whole organization before he gets shitcanned himself.
Also, Russ Ortiz pitched well after he was let go. Dayton will assume he can “produce at his accustomed level” and do it again.
Guerrero would never sign here.
He will when he has a fake hip and he is offered 23 million over 3 years
Desperately hoping for Desperate Measures
by averagegatsby on Aug 31, 2009 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions
There's absolutely nothing...
…in that statement that justifies your cheapshot. As HRTC said, you should step away from the computer a bit more when you’re in a down mood. If you’re getting paid to write everyday for the site, and hence to generate traffic, your mood is counterproductive. I’m sure the SB Nation folks could find someone, if they’re paying, that can balance criticism and praise a bit better. – TL
Speeaking of "cheapshots"
might want to re-think that last sentence
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at Driveline Mechanics.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Aug 31, 2009 8:25 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
There's no need for me...
…to “rethink” the last sentence because it’s a sentiment based on evidence—-the evidence provided in HRTC’s post as well as any number of posts since June. Dissing GMDM for not having been here to draft Greinke is a cheapshot; calling for a editorial replacement at RR based on a trackrecord of negativity is not. At this point, Devil Fingers, I’d take you as the full-time editor as long as you could resist mind-numbing negativity. For instance, why not celebrate Greinke’s accomplishment(s), numerically if by no other way, per some of Sam Mellinger’s posts? – TL
It's his Blog
Frankly, what right do you have to ask for him to be stripped of it? RoyalsReview was around pre-SBNation, just so you are aware.
TL... you have your right to your opinion.
Until you start posting articles on a daily basis or even commenting on a daily basis I will fain interest in what you have to say. Other than that I will view you as just another part time fan who isn’t happy with the content of this blog. If you don’t like the tone then click on somewhere else. It takes a lot of effort to edit a very successful blog for 365 days a year and still have a life. I have been on here since 2004 and this has been one of the best Royals blogs year in and year out. As JQ named it a couple years back, it is “Our little online pub.”
Finally, you can have your opinion and voice it here… BUT, don’t mess with our blog.
Try editing you own blog, I for one would be interested to see how long you would last at it or if you could get the traffic that RR. does.
Dude, thanks for giving me...
…your permission for me to have my opinion, here or elsewhere. Wow, do I feel better.
Will knows who I am—-even if he doesn’t always agree with my opinions (or I with his). I dropped off for a bit this summer, but I’ve been pretty steady since early 2008. You don’t have to be daily to have street cred here. NYRoyals pops in and out. Whatever. – TL
but, asking him to leave just because you disagree
with him and the blogs tone is lacking a lot of street cred for me…dude.
by grudz96 on Aug 31, 2009 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Except that those homegrown players aren't Dayton's, and aren't likely to be any time soon.
What about homegrown Kila and Carlos Rosa? They don’t count I guess, so he can’t call them up.
The Process™ from the offseason til the trade deadline: Trade away homegrown talent.
The Process™ after the trade deadline: Complain about the lack of homegrown talent.
I don't understand why you look at it as a "PR campaign"
His statement is accurate. That’s what I don’t get, is that people take these seemingly disconnected things and try to fit them together in one grand analysis.
He is accurate that most of our roster needs to be homegrown.
Trading players for other players of need is a valid strategy for building a team.
He made a bad trade.
It’s really not part of any grand conspiracy…he’s either good enough to get the job done here or he’s not. I guess what bothers me is that you’re trying to “sell” us on the fact that he’s a bad GM by pulling out every stop, whether or not it’s entirely accurate. Believe me, his moves alone are probably going to be enough to get him canned at some point.
I personally don’t see arrogance or disdain for the fans in his statements. I see someone who may not be good enough to get the job done here, plain and simple. I think if we all stick to that instead of trying to read into everything that he says , we’ll all be much better off.
Kansas City Royals - rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic since 1994.
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Aug 31, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
they are powder-blue glasses,
sir.
Kansas City Royals - rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic since 1994.
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Aug 31, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Is this an honest statement?
I personally don’t see arrogance or disdain for the fans in his statements.
I’m teaching right now, but I can easily find 10 quotes from GMDM that show arrogance/disdain. Well, if I can pull my head out of the sand.
He can get 4, NOT 5.
eh, students were working on data collection for a science project.
Trying to teach them some excel, it’s interesting.
He can get 4, NOT 5.
Hopefully one or two can turn into sabermetricians.
They’re 10 years old, I figure by the time they graduate the Royals will be using computers, 2017 or so.
He can get 4, NOT 5.
Please do
some of those may be a matter of interpretation, but whatever.
Look, I get where many of you guys are at. I was there with Carl Peterson for a long time. I saw the absolute worst ulterior motives in everything he said and did. So, I get where you guys are coming from with DM, but I’m not at that place yet.
He may not succeed here, and god knows I get frustrated, but it’s too early IMO to just throw the whole thing out and say it’s time to run him out of here. Just my opinion.
Kansas City Royals - rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic since 1994.
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Aug 31, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions
For some strange reason, I actually agree with this.
but it’s too early IMO to just throw the whole thing out and say it’s time to run him out of here.
However, I believe he needs to drastically change his approach this offseason. His quotes or “pr” makes it seem like the Royals are on the right track and we’re all just too dumb to see it.
He can get 4, NOT 5.
Which is why the extension makes little sense now
If he changes his approach, sure give him an extension, but now? When he just finished making the worst moves of his career, you’re going to give him an extension now?!?? That’s the mind-boggling part.
we’re all just too dumb to see it
We obviously are. He knew we’d be furious with the Betancourt trade.
Ok, a quick google search:
“I go back to the same thing all of the time,” he said. “If our processes were so poor, how were we able to put together a pretty good team in the off-season?”
I knew we’d be criticized for that before we did it. I can’t worry about that. But (the criticism) doesn’t make sense. If we operated that way, we wouldn’t have promoted Luke Hochevar when we did or promoted Kyle Davies when we did.
"Let’s just trust the process. If other people don’t want to trust the process, that’s fine. If other people want to abandon the process, then abandon it. I’m not abandoning the process. I believe in the process."
"I’m always re-evaluating decisions that we make," Moore said. "All of the time. But Luke Hochevar, does he look good for us? Banny? Zack? Zack’s had a breakout year. Boy, I’m glad we were proactive and aggressive with that."
“When our top advisors, people I consider the very best evaluators in the game, advise me that, ‘If you can get this guy, you get him,’ that’s exactly what we did.”
"Our processes are good. Our processes are consistent. We’re not right all of the time, but the effort is there, the passion is there and we will get this thing done without a doubt in my mind as we move forward. I believe that with all of my heart."
Maybe that one isn’t arrogance, just ignorance.
The crown jewel:
When you watch baseball games every single day, it’s very apparent who can play defensively and who can’t.
He can get 4, NOT 5.
by Warden11 on Aug 31, 2009 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
from today:
"This year’s an example of anything that could go wrong did go wrong,"
Um, really? Maybe the team just isn’t any good.
This is from Mellinger:
Moore spoke mostly in general terms, but did indicate that some major changes to the big league roster could be in store, while saying the added job security would not impact his decisions.
Seems like I’ve heard that before…not sure it’s a good thing.
He can get 4, NOT 5.
In other good news
Rowdy Hardy is apparently good again…at least ERA wise.
Mourning Guy Carbonneau...
Royals obscure player to watch in ST: Lenny DiNardo
by playingwithfire on Aug 30, 2009 11:03 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
FoxSports Radio
baseball analyst (I think his name was Banny something) stated that he would vote for Zack because his ERA is 1 point lower than any other pitcher and he gets 3 less runs a game to work with than the other contenders on a awful team (his words).
I really think it is a no-brainer.
Halladay has been getting lit up this month.
Desperately hoping for Desperate Measures
by averagegatsby on Aug 31, 2009 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions
We have the Cy Young winner and we lose 100 plus games, again.
I guess it is something to be happy about. I think even Zack would forgo the award if the Royals could challening for a playoff spot.
If one more person tells me to believe in the “process.” What process???? Drafting or gambling on some kid who may or may not make it pass AA. In the meantime we set around with our thumbs up our butt and smile and accept all the crap that Dayton and Hillfart are force feeding us. The process can’t be one sided… draft and wait. You have to deal with the real world now. No rookies brought up this season even for a one game cup of coffee. Nothing done this season except bring in leftovers from other teams garbage.
If my “cred” has been lessen by my negativity, so be it. Right now the Royals suck and so does the organization. Zack has matured as a person and a pitcher. I wallow in his victories, but even that won’t wash away the rotten smell of this stinking organization.
Tell me ...
How is it possible not to be negative? I was wary at the start of the season when, with all the optimism, Sidney Ponson was touted as a fourth starter. Even a semi-casual fan like myself knew that this was a disaster waiting to happen. Some things that happen seemed just bad luck (Crisp injury, Gordon injury, etc.), but the fact is that year after year this team totally sucks, with no improvement in sight. I speak as one who has followed KC baseball since 1950 as a tiny kid. Irrespective of whose fault it is, responsibility for not being comptetitive year after year has to go somewhere.
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