#Royals say RHP Gil Meche will need shoulder surgey and miss the rest of the year.
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utterly shocked?
The only measure of true success in the NFL is the Vince Lombardi trophy. Anything less is a rationalization.
Whoa.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Are your posts sponsored now?
How can I get a sweet gig like that?
by Soria's Unibrow on Jul 27, 2010 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Very, very sad.
I’ve always rooted for Gil. This is probably the end of the line for him, though.
Trey Hillman, and to a broader extent this organization, ruined his career.
FREE BRAYAN PENA.
well, $55 million is a nice golden parachute out of the plane
by Freneau on Jul 27, 2010 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
It is, but he performed well his first season and up to par his second.
He was doing everything we asked of him, but Hillman’s boneheaded philosophy about pitch count was just detrimental.
The Texas game this season is the most egregious mistake to me. Hillman was completely clueless and it cost this guy his career.
FREE BRAYAN PENA.
I just don't buy this Hillman thing
The idea that 15 pitches more than normal killed his career reeks of looking desperately for an explanation for him suddenly going down.
Not 15 pitches more.
Consistently, last year, pitching him into the 130s. Then you add that every extra inning he went out there, he probably threw 8 warmup pitches as well.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Um
I suggest you look up the pitch counts…
His longest outing was 132 pitches- “the game”.
Next are 121, 120, 116, 115, 114, 113, 110
And he did that consistently
That’s what my point is, and that’s what matters. I’m guessing he had one of the higher pitch total averages for all starters. He probably was in the top 5 for pitcher abuse points last year too. My point is, he threw around 115 consistently (And for no reason).
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Pitcher Abuse Points
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/statistics/sortable/index.php?cid=72088
Notice: Meche only started 23 games, but was still pretty high on this list.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Yeah
But the idea that he “consistently, last year, pitched into the 130’s” is total bunk.
He seems to have had a routine limit of around 115. Which is entirely consistent with previous years (in ’08, he had a 115 pitch count 4 times).
He pitches 17 pitches extra, and we all rush to call that a career killer?
The timing was important
I seem to remember him pitching into 130s on game and then 115 or something the next game. If he pitched into the 130s, then common sense tells me that next game his limit should be 100. And all the warmup pitches skew the number.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
he threw a whopping 75 after the 130 game....so you remember incorrectly
but I don’t buy the whole pitch count thing either. Why haven’t other guys fallen to pieces (i.e. Sabathia with Milwaukee, who started on short rest and racked up the following):
Meche had made every start for his first two years in KC, leading the league both times. Add that to his last year in Seattle, and that’s 100 starts in three seasons.
by Fernando Vina School of Linguistics on Jul 28, 2010 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions
It was 75 in 3.1 innings...that's kind of important if you're saying he showed no ill effects after the 130.
Then he threw 84 in 5 innings. Following that game he threw his 121 in 6 freaking innings.
The final pitch counts might not be crazy but he was throwing a ton of pitches per inning.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
he's always done that
by Fernando Vina School of Linguistics on Jul 28, 2010 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions
True. But 75 pitches in 3.1 innings is bad.
Along with 120 in 6…The Royals may not have been the main reason he went down but I do believe they fired the kill shot.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
15 is a generous number.
He pitched 120+ and sometimes 130+ numerous times. That complete game was a brilliant performance, but it was an astonishing pitch total. It was the last good Gil Meche start we’ll probably ever see.
FREE BRAYAN PENA.
remember the 120 pitch game after Meche was at risk of missing that game
Meche got a lot of huge loads in a row, at a time that he was experiencing arm/shoulder pain. And the disappearance of pain through a move on the rubber seems to be a coping mechanism, that screwed things up worse.
Follow me on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bhindepmo (follow me, because reloading my twitter page 40 times a day is kind of creepy)
I get tweets from Goldberg on my phone
Pretty timely information. And he doesn’t tweet about his personal life, which is great.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Same with Dutton
He’s essential following for any Royals fan.
It's all ball bearings these days!
by CentralChamps20?? on Jul 27, 2010 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think I could ever follow Dutton.
He’s just so stupid. Or is that Kaegel?
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
no, follow dutton
its all just pure royals information: lineups, injuries, trades, etc.
he’s breaking most of it, so you’ll get it 5 minutes faster, if you care about that
Only if it means posting stuff before you.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Dutton is a great reporter
Frankly, given the sacrifices to his sanity he must make dealing with Royals PR all day every day, we owe it to him
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at FanGraphs and Beyond the Box Score.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Jul 27, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Ok ok...
I must have been thinking of Kaegel. It’s sad when MLB.com is the absolute worst place to get baseball news.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Not that surprising
Along the same lines as the Ministry of Information and Press not being the best place to get accurate and truthful information about the USSR.
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jul 27, 2010 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions
I've always thought that
Think of how bitter Dutton and Denny Mathews and Kaegel must all be that they’ve been there every freaking day for the last 25 years of this crap franchise.
I would have started pulling a Harry Doyle during broadcasts years ago
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jul 27, 2010 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you can hear it in Denny's voice a lot
Especially on nights when things aren’t going so well. There’s been a couple times I thought he was another dropped ball away from going insane.
I just logged on
to post it myself. Man, Twitter is awesome.
It's all ball bearings these days!
by CentralChamps20?? on Jul 27, 2010 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't know about Twitter being awesome.
I wish there was another way for news to break, but it’s what we have.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
hahahahahahahaha
didn’t we want him to have surgery last offseason and he declined? I used to like Meche but if that is the case then he is just selfish.
by I need more Esteban on Jul 27, 2010 5:28 PM EDT reply actions
The Royals are still to blame for ruining his shoulder in the first place.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
that's some fierce bursitis
seriously, does anyone know if it’s rotator cuff, labrum, or other? is there a scenario where he comes back by next spring depending on what’s wrong?
BOOM YOSTED!
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Jul 27, 2010 5:31 PM EDT reply actions
I've been saying labrum since late spring.
Coffee. The NEW Performance Enhancing drug for Sport's Writers. Just ask Ken Rosenthal.
Number of people surprised by this = zero
The whole time Meche was rehabbing they were saying he couldn’t throw his curve because it hurt too much, but he still kept trying to come back.
by swing and a miss on Jul 27, 2010 5:33 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Shouldn't the organization have, I don't know, stepped in or something?
If it hurt to throw a CURVE BALL, maybe something wasn’t right internally?
FREE BRAYAN PENA.
who knows....maybe they were probably giving him a chance to see if it would fix itself
if it did….great.
if not, have the surgery and be back in time for spring training.
by Fernando Vina School of Linguistics on Jul 28, 2010 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions
We don't tell players what to do
If Gil wanted to play centerfield, who are we to stop him?
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
by RoyalsRetro on Jul 28, 2010 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I could see them putting off surgery to try to get something out of him in the next year.
Now, who knows if he’ll even pitch next year? Then they’ll be paying him for nothing. (N.B. I think surgery earlier was the right move, but I can see a reason the organization was willing to delay.)
IT'S STILL NOTHING SERIOUS!
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jul 27, 2010 5:34 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
/code!
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at FanGraphs and Beyond the Box Score.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Jul 27, 2010 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Under the new training staff, I wouldn't think so.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Furthermore, if I'm Meche (or his agent)
there’s no way I keep going out there so the Royals can satisfy their hopes of squeezing as much value as they can out of my contract…at the expense of whatever might be left of my career with proper treatment.
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jul 27, 2010 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions
But we've all been saying that he's done for a while.
Don’t you think they went with the most optimistic diagnosis they could?
That may be true, but they didn't knowingly throw him out there and hope for a miracle.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Jason Isringhausen is a snake handler
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at FanGraphs and Beyond the Box Score.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Jul 27, 2010 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, I think this means the Mega-Deal of Fail is off
especially with the Mets possibly needing Frenchy now that Bay is hurt
:(
Things couldn't have worked out better concerning that Mega-Deal of Fail
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Gil will return next year as a one armed loogy
Follow me on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bhindepmo (follow me, because reloading my twitter page 40 times a day is kind of creepy)
kind of like Dave Dravecky in reverse?
interesting
The only measure of true success in the NFL is the Vince Lombardi trophy. Anything less is a rationalization.
Something that just occurred to me.
In a couple years, we might all be talking about whether the lack of righties in the rotation will be a problem.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
As opposed to now
when the “lack of any good pitchers” is the problem?
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jul 27, 2010 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, a preseason discussion point
When everyone was still optimistic, we all talked about how we had a rotation full of righties. Spring Training 2012, we’ll have Zack and a bunch of lefties it looks like.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Not so fast
Let's wait to see what kind of magic Dayton can wield in the offseason.
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jul 27, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
You mean, he's bringing in Jeff Suppan?
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
Shhhh
You’ll give away his spells and tricks!
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jul 27, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
I'll be a bit surprised if Zack is still a Royal in 2012
I predict our new GM trades him off.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
who's "we"?
I don’t give a crap about the handedness of the starting pitchers roster. Only GMDM does.
'The Writers Junction'
in Santa Monica, CA
by SagehenMacGyver47 on Jul 27, 2010 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions
MLB TV just reported that the Royals origional theory on Meche was
To trade him after the third year of his contract. Well, now he’s hurt and he can’t be traded.
Coffee. The NEW Performance Enhancing drug for Sport's Writers. Just ask Ken Rosenthal.
if true
That’s just makes things even crazier. Betting on just about any pitcher being good over five years is crazy enough, but making part of his potential trade value after three years (with two expensive years left on his contract) is just… what’s the word?
At this point: predictable
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at FanGraphs and Beyond the Box Score.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Jul 27, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
That there is some good
strategery
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jul 27, 2010 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions
I've been preaching labrum for how long now?
Coffee. The NEW Performance Enhancing drug for Sport's Writers. Just ask Ken Rosenthal.
My guess is that his arm is actually hanging by a thread.
- "But Frank, that's the worst shortstop in the league."
- "That's what they keep tellin' me."
If it is a labrum
then Gil’s pretty much done, right? At least with the Royals?
http://www.slate.com/id/2100895
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jul 27, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
You'd have to think any sort of surgery and he's probably done with the Royals
With a year+ on the recovery time
Unless I'm wrong...
My Twitter feed
IMO he's done...period.
Ned likes Kendall in the 2-hole!
by mitchfreakingmaier! on Jul 27, 2010 6:29 PM EDT reply actions
I guess the wolves are at ol' Gil's door...
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at FanGraphs and Beyond the Box Score.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Jul 27, 2010 6:50 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
HAHAH!
Given enough velocity even a pig will fly
by MarioVanPeebles Republic of China on Jul 27, 2010 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions
i wish i knew how to paste in a pic of dr nick
Hi everybody!
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Jul 27, 2010 7:03 PM EDT reply actions
Here ya go.
Given enough velocity even a pig will fly
by MarioVanPeebles Republic of China on Jul 27, 2010 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Attention Royals fans!
Please disperse! Please disperse!
There’s nothing to see here!
There’s nothing to see here, please!
This is horrible news.
I really feel bad for the guy. Sure, he’s overpaid. But shoulder surgery probably means the end of his career. I can’t wish that on anyone—-except maybe Bonds. Wait, he’s gone already. – TL
"Sir,--It has been wittily remarked that there are three kinds of falsehood: the first is a 'fib,' the second is a downright lie, and the third and most aggravated is statistics." *The National Observer* (June 13, 1891): p. 93-94.
Further proof 5 year guaranteed contracts for pitchers are a bad idea
especially for someone with a history of shoulder problems like Meche had before signing with the Royals. The high pitch counts did not help, but I think Meche just had an expiration date.
What an offseason of fail
Winter of 2006:
Alfonso Soriano 8/$136 mill
Barry Zito 7/$126 mill
Jeff Suppan 4/$42 mill
Vincente Padilla 3/$34 mill
Miguel Batista 3/$24 mill
Jason Schmidt 3/$47 mill
Gary Matthews 5/$50 mill
Gil Meche 5/$55 mill
Julio Lugo 3/$36 mill
Adam Eaton 3/$24 mill
Danys Baez 3/$19 mill
Juan Pierre 4/$44 mill
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
It would be interesting to go back to each offseason
and add up the total dollars per WAR spent that year. It would seem the Winter of 2006 has to be a frontrunner for the worst. A collective orgy of overpaying for nonperformance.
"Now…put that in your [BLEEP]ing pipe and smoke it." -Hal McRae
"I was doing this when BJ was in his father's nutsack." -Renzo Gracie
by Sweep_the_Leg on Jul 28, 2010 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions
preliminary estimate
eleventy billion
But hey, Jim Hendry and the Cubs had BA’s #1 farm system in 2002 and went to the NLCS in 2003!
I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at FanGraphs and Beyond the Box Score.
Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.
by Matt Klaassen on Jul 28, 2010 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, whatever caused it,
he’s finished. He may never throw another pitch. I figure they bought Meche planning to compete in 2009-2010, and that’s all fallen through now. He’s got more money than all of us put together will ever see, but it’s still too bad because he always seemed like a stand-up guy. Our starting rotation is a mess. Then again, so’s the rest of the team except Billy and Jack.
"The bowler's Holding, the batsman's Willey" - Unfortunate cricket commentator
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