Edwin Jackson reportedly signing with Nationals
Jon Heyman just tweeted that Edwin Jackson was seen in the Washington airport, on his way to take their physical. Clearly Dayton was serious about not making any more major moves.
4 months ago
mmiller9
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Sorry to HarryL
I deleted your post and kept this one up on the topic. It was the first one up.
Doubting Thomas, the patron saint of sabermetrics
Ha ha - no worries, Jeff...
I guess I hadn’t refreshed the FanShots page recently enough before I posted. =)
I really would have liked to see Dayton top this deal
Maybe I’m starting to get Rany-style blinders on, but Jackson would have been a nice improvement for the Royals at a reasonable price.
Maybe you are, and I might be there with you.
But I try to remember that nothing is a given. However unlikely, the Royals have a chance to win the division, and it’s obviously a better chance than the last several years. So that is something. Rather than saying “EJax would not have put us over the top”, we should be saying “EJax would have made it a little more likely that we would win the division.”
Shit happens. Verlander, Cabrera, or Fielder could get hurt. Avila could play horrible. Scherzer could lose all control of his fastball. So we never know. Now… having said that. I don’t think a 1-year deal for EJax would have been a good idea. 2 or 3 years I would prefer.
How reasonable was his price?
What was it?
You may know me as NYRoyal.
by Scott McKinney on Feb 2, 2012 2:38 PM EST up reply actions
wait...
one year deal. nevermind. not booooooo!
by YouDon'tPhaseMeGobble on Feb 2, 2012 2:28 PM EST up reply actions
I can see prefering Washington though
Bigger ballpark, NL will help his numbers as he tries to go on next year’s market.
Plus Washington still has a strong African-American population for what that’s worth. I think I read the team is trying to get some more African-American ballplayers to appeal to that base – that’s in part why they wanted Prince Fielder (well that and he’s a great bat)
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
About appealing to the African American community
I really would love to see some research on whether that affects attendance for that demographic. I just don’t see that making any difference. For whatever reason (and I really don’t want to be making assertions about the reason), black people don’t seem to be drawn to other black people unless they are a rapper or a politician who is a Democrat.
There are probably more examples. I also may be way off because I lack information, but I’m betting nobody else has the kind of information we need to make conclusions on this.
i would be ticket prices have a bigger impact than the number of Af. Am. players
of course ticket prices are the biggest reason in dont take in a lot of games and i’m not Black. so maybe its just ecomonic status things and not a color thing.
by DickHowser4ever on Feb 2, 2012 2:55 PM EST up reply actions
wow. i think i cam off like an incredible douche with that post.....my apologies.
by DickHowser4ever on Feb 2, 2012 2:55 PM EST up reply actions
Don't Worry; You
Were totally credible
I used to be an A's fan until they left town and got good.
by philofthenorth on Feb 2, 2012 3:04 PM EST up reply actions
An NHL example
Back before they moved up to Winnipeg and became the Jets Mk. 2, they were the Atlanta Thrashers. They had more prominent black players than any other team and a large black population in the home city, so they tried to market to them. It worked so well the team got moved a couple of years later.
For whatever reason, it doesn’t seem to work. Maybe it comes off condescending?
by Soria's Unibrow on Feb 2, 2012 3:26 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
The Nats owners are more interested in attracting Phillies fans than building a local fanbase
And the fact that they insist on building giant parking garages even though the ballpark is practically on top of a Metro station tells you everything you need to know about the local fans that they’re trying to attract.
But Wilmington, Delaware
IS ROYALS COUNTRY.
The one time I went through Wilmington, honest to god, I did find a Royals bumper sticker.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
Wilmington is a surprisingly nice town
I worked there as part of the advance team for the inauguration (the train trip the weekend before included a stop and speech in Wilmington where Biden joined the train) and the locals were extremely nice. I don’t know if it’s all the out-of-towners that come to work at the banks or the farm club or what, but I got several comments on my Royals stocking cap.
so...they make it convenient for locals and out of towners?
seems like smart business to me
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 2, 2012 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
They essentially put Phillies-Nats tickets on sale in Philadelphia before they could be bought in DC
It didn’t go over very well here. They have essentially no local fanbase.
And building parking garages that block the view of the Capitol Dome is just bizarre. The sort of people who are so committed to driving that they’d choose to try to negotiate downtown DC traffic instead of taking the metro are the sort of people who’ll come to maybe 5 games a year. They could have had iconic skyline in the outfield, but instead they’ve got plenty of parking spaces that are almost never full.
These idiots have no idea what they’re doing from a marketing perspective.
we'll see how much that marketing matters when they have two of the most hyped and talented prospects playing side by side
for 5 years.
and if i’m a nats fan, im ecstatic with the lerners…they’re clearly trying to win
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 2, 2012 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
Clearly trying to win plus a new stadium isn't doing much for them so far
They’re barely beating out the O’s for worst attendance in the Northeast. I’m sure if they’re in first, the stadium will fill up (at least at first for the novelty), but no team is in first every year, and I just don’t see this team sustaining attendance through the bad times until they get new people in charge.
I know that they weren’t even selling out their home openers, but trying to remedy that by selling all the tickets to fans of the visiting team is incredibly penny-wise and pound-foolish.
And there are dozens of examples like that. For example, they hold back the cheap seats on nights they’re expecting big attendance (e.g. Cubs games) to try to force people to buy the more expensive seats, but instead they just get hundreds of people returning home. It’s not just the forgone concession revenues; it’s also the negative experience you’re creating for the age group that should be the core of your long-term fanbase. Just incredibly stupid.
it was one signing in a season where cash cow #1 didnt pitch....
we’ll see what happens when harper is there.
i think an underrated aspect of what happened there is that when the team came to town, they played in a shit stadium…they werent able to capitalize on the newness of the team and stadium at the same time.
isnt DC alot like florida in that most of the local population isnt really local…mostly transplants who presumably already have a team?
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 3, 2012 1:19 AM EST up reply actions
They actually drew better to RFK than they have been to Nationals Park
The most amazing thing to me is how they’ve burnt bridges with local media so that the coverage by the Post borders on actively hostile. It’s like they saw that the Redskins were the most popular team in town and so they decided to copy Dan Snyder’s approach to running things.
I don’t think DC is necessarily a transplant city in general, but that’s definitely true for the 18-35 crowd, who ought to make up a big part of the baseball-going market. I’d actually think that would make it less important that they field a winning team, but stunts like the cheap-ticket holdback really hurt them among this crowd. Speaking only for myself, I take the 75-minute MARC train up to Orioles Park about 3 times as often a season as I take the 25-minute Metro ride down to Nats Park.
The one good thing to come of it is that I don’t think I’d have gotten into MLS as much as I have if the Nats were run better or the Orioles were more convenient to get to.
Is a parking garage plus a Metro station a bad idea?
It’s not like one could or should expect the vast majority of fans to get to the stadium via the Metro, right? I mean NYC has a great subway system and there is a subway stop right at Yankee Stadium (3 lines converging there), and it also has a huge parking garage. I’m no planner, but aren’t both necessary?
You may know me as NYRoyal.
by Scott McKinney on Feb 3, 2012 10:51 AM EST up reply actions
It's been several years since I've lived in DC
But I’ve got to think that, especially for the Virginia-side families, it’s still a lot more convenient for them to load up the car with the kids and drive over to the stadium. If you live out by the Vienna station on the Orange line or Franconia-Springfield on the Blue line, then driving a family of four in and parking in the garage probably makes sense. Or if dad took the Metro to work, and can meet the wife and kids at the stadium by taking the Metro, but riding home with them in the car, etc.
It’s also proactive from a development perspective. Wasn’t Nats Park supposed to lead to a big redevelopment of the SE DC riverfront? I’m not sure how quickly or how well that is happening, but I thought that was part of the intent of putting the park where they did.
by Sweep_the_Leg on Feb 3, 2012 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
I think for any stadium, there will always be a significant number of people for which driving is a better choice than taking mass transit. If that’s true for Yankee Stadium, with NYC’s extensive mass transit system, then it must be true other places with less fulsome systems (like DC). And of course there are people who just want to drive, period, and will choose against mass transit.
You may know me as NYRoyal.
by Scott McKinney on Feb 3, 2012 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
The development of the SW waterfront, which is centered around Arena Stage Theater is going pretty well
The development of the adjoining SE waterfront, which is centered around the ballpark is totally stalled out.
The blocks to the north of the ballpark are still empty lots and surface parking. (map: http://g.co/maps/by8ut) I’m not going to put all of that on the Lerners since the developers who were attracted to the area seem to have been pretty financially irresponsible across the board, but the Nats alienation of young fans certainly isn’t helping the area.
I don't know the layout at Yankees stadium, but Nats park is not very car-accessible
The location was picked in large part because the land was less expensive because of its inaccessibilty. The city spent millions upgrading the Metro stadium and building a new entrance/exit to serve the stadium. They used eminent domain to take property to develop not just the ballpark but a retail area around the stadium, and they sold this to taxpayers partly on the basis of a park that would have the city’s most iconic skyline as a backdrop.
The Lerners used a little contract sleight of hand to build parking garages instead of retail, which undermined the city’s redevelopment plans, ruined the view from the seats, and prevented the sort of bar district that makes Camden Yards a great place to spend the whole day instead of just the three hours of gametime.
And now the parking garages sit mostly empty because it’s just too hard to drive to that part of DC for ballgames.
You are joking right?
It is right off of 295 and 395. If you live in DC, then no it is not easily accessible by car, because nothing is. But it would be fine for those coming from Maryland (295) or Virginia (395).
As to the Skyline argument, here is picture of the stadium you can see the Capitol Building is directly behind left field and clearly visible.
#extendZim
You must not get Nationals e-mails.
I just got one today for a “Take Back The Park” promotion they’re doing to keep Phillies fans out of the ballpark.
They go directly to my trash folder.
But it’s ridiculous to have a Take Back The Park promotion when your own marketing department is the one that gave the Phillies fans first dibs on tickets the year before.
It's super ridiculous since they don't care about the local fan base
The Nats owners are more interested in attracting Phillies fans than building a local fanbase.
They made a mistake, but it is an understandable one. It wasn’t as though the marketing pushed the idea in Philly. Several parks offer group tickets before selling single tickets, so that you don’t end up with some random guy sitting in the middle of your 28 person group. That the Phillies have a significantly larger fan base should not be surprising for a number of reasons.
#extendZim
Why you'd even offer group sales to opening day is beyond me.
Offering them before individual ticket sales makes it pretty obvious what your real goal is.
Prince
I wonder if the Fielder signing kept Dayton from pursuing Jackson, knowing that the Tigers are now the hands down favorite in the Central…
If kcgregory's $10M number is right...
Then I’m not sure we had the payroll room. I think I remember hearing that DM was trying to stay under $70M, and based on the KC Star story (http://royalsblog.kansascity.com/?q=node/972), we were at around $60M without Gordon ($47.7M for 15 guys + ~$500K each for 24 more non-arbitration-eligible guys).
It's the Nationals, so I can sorta assume an "overpay"...
…but I’m fully prepared to throw up in my mouth when I find out the contract details.
Nick Swisher is hands^h^h^h^h^h delicious.
we'll see what happens next year...
people said that about the beltre one year deal and beltre had a huge season and got like $100 million
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 2, 2012 3:44 PM EST up reply actions
Beltre though was coming off a horrible year in which he was injured for most of it
Jackson is coming off a pretty good year in which he pitched about as well as he could be expected to perform. Unless the reportd three-year deals were phantoms or for something ridiculous like $5 million per year, I am not sure Jackson stands to gain much even if he pitches well again next year. The injury risk generally applicable to all pitchers makes this a pretty risky move without a strong chance of a huge payoff.
Well, yeah.
…like $5 million per year, I am not sure Jackson stands to gain much…
Even the non-nerds could see that.
Maybe their playoff payoff is that much better with the Nationals.
Again, I’ll wait until the final contract details are “public” but damn if 3/30;4/40 couldn’t have easily gotten this done.
Nick Swisher is hands^h^h^h^h^h delicious.
maybe he didnt really want to pitch for the orioles...
the red sox have a bunch of money coming off the books next season as do some other teams
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 2, 2012 6:15 PM EST up reply actions
I saw some analysis
That showed the money coming off the books for the Sox will be swallowed up by raises to other players, but I could be wrong.
I agree, he probably didn’t want to play for the O’s.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
i dont see a ton of raises coming....
ellsbury will get a bunch but between ortiz, dice-k, danks you’re looking at about $35 million. most of the raises will be of the $2 million or so variety
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 2, 2012 9:34 PM EST up reply actions
Great value signing If the deal is $10 million
I did not want Jackson on a long-term deal, but this would have a great short-term pickup.
I am kinda happy we didnt make this move.
I think that if we are in the race GMDM will make a move that will put us over the top, Edwin Jackson is not that guy!
by Thompson15 on Feb 2, 2012 4:59 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I still don't think contention is likely
but a 1/$10M deal for Jackson, with either a sign-and-flip or contend-and-keep contingency would have been great, assuming Glass allowed the payroll bump. I wonder how much of the Royals’ apparent lack of interest is purely budgetary, and how much of it is Dayton really saying “nope, we’re good…you know we signed Chen, right?” and meaning it.
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