OT: HBO Series "Luck"
As we unwind the dirty end of winter towards pitchers & catchers reporting and spring training, many of you may be tempted to whittle the hours via HBO's new series, "Luck". The show is produced by David Milch, who is responsible for some remarkable television, a genius who has redefined the genre in many ways (Deadwood, Hill St Blues, LA Law). Luck is set at Santa Anita park in LA, one of the last bastions of big time horse racing west of the Mississippi. The series features some heavyweights, including Dusty Hoffman, Nick Nolte, Dennis Farina, and the brilliant mofo's who played Dan Dougherty and Jewell from Deadwood, among others. As per usual, the dialogue crackles with Milch's peculiar mix of eloquence, profanity, intelligence,and the patios of the alternately seedy and glamorous horse track culture.
Milch, never one to spoon feed or insult his audience, drops viewers directly down into the grandstands, with not much in the way of explanation for some of the arcane in's and out's of track life. From the nuances of betting a pick 6, to claiming races, to trainers betting on races, to why you wouldn't want a jockey yammering about being on a good horse, and the fickle relationship between owners, trainers, jockey agents, and jockeys; many of the plot threads in Luck appear to be buiding upon a flimsy grasp of some previous horse gambling knowledge.
As a degenerate horse player for many years. I'm here to help. Post your horse racing questions, handicapping tips, questions about WTF is character X doing in situation Y, etc.....let me be your Luck sherpa. I'm not Alan Sepinwall. I'm merely offering to flesh out horse stuff. Don't let your lack of interest or familiarity with a crooked, unforgiving, and virtually obsolete nook of sporting culture get in the way of enjoying some good television.
FWIW, Liasion was done well before he clipped heels and lost his rider Sat in the Robert Lewis Stakes. Which may be good for his odds next time out. Alpha has looked good in NY, but not sure if his competition amounts to much. I'll Have Another, upset winner of the Robert Lewis, is one to keep an eye on.
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i havent yet watched the 2nd episode...
it seems like it will be a remarkably well made show, i just dont know if i will be able to really get into it. its such a foreign concept to most people, that they’re going to have to spend a ton of time explaining what the hell is going on
Fire Everyone
I know there are a bunch of Deadwood fans on the boards
I thought I’d throw up the fanpost to help paper over any gaps in the plot, etc….so shoot me a question if you run into one. From what I’ve read, the series starts to gel and hit stride in episode 4. Most of the great series take awhile to develop and hook you, I’m optimistic Luck will be a good one. But I’m a soft touch due to the subject matter. Seeing guys put together a pick six ticket and actually looking at a racing form made me weak in the knees.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
yeah...boardwalk empire was really slow the first few episodes
and it is awesome…i hope luck is really good…can never have enough good tv to watch
that whole pick 6 concept seemed really strange to me…i’ll watch the first episode again before i harass you with any questions about it
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 6, 2012 3:53 PM EST up reply actions
yeah...boardwalk empire was really slow the first few episodes
and it is awesome…i hope luck is really good…can never have enough good tv to watch
that whole pick 6 concept seemed really strange to me…i’ll watch the first episode again before i harass you with any questions about it
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 6, 2012 3:54 PM EST up reply actions
I want to spread the gospel of the debauched horse racing culture
in no way would I consider it harassment. No question is too small. No question is too big. Each question is just right. The Pick Six: Picking the winner of 6 consecutive races. Considering pro handicappers are fortunate to hit around 35% of their selections, 6 in a row is a feat of Hosmerian proportions. Most sharpies pool money or form syndicates, and put in hugethousand dollar bets when the pay-off approaches mid to high 6 digits for a pick six. Its not at all uncommon for NO ONE to pick a winner of all six, in which case the money in the pot rolls over to the next day, and then you end up with situations like episode 1, where there is 2 mill in the pot. Here is how it gets expensive: you pay $2 for each horse you want to include in your wager. For example if you like 3 horses in the first race, 2 in the 2nd, 5 in the 3rd, 3 in the 4th, 5 in the 5th, and 8 in the 6th, that ticket would cost you: 3×2×5x3x5×8 = 3600 combinations at $2 a combination = a $7200 wager. And you have to have the winner of each of the 6 races on your ticket to win.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 4:05 PM EST up reply actions
why wouldnt you just bet on every horse when the jackpot gets that big?
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 6, 2012 4:24 PM EST up reply actions
with so much on the line and the relatively small marginal cost of adding one more horse
why would they not at least bet on the favorite too in the race in which they only had the one longshot horse?
That seemed a little too far fetched and designed simply to create a false sense of drama.
you have to make your bet before the series of 6 races starts
You make your pick 6 play before the 1st race in the pick 6. You could, in theory, “buy” each horse in every race, but it would always cost more than your payout would be. If there were 10 horses in each race, you’d be betting: 10×10×10x10x10X10 = a shit ton of money.
They actually had “All” in the last race. So they did have every horse covered. The horses with the higher odds were paying out the most. Adding one additional horse to a pick 6 ticket is generally an expensive proposition. Most players have at least 2 races where they are “singling” a horse. So if that horse doesn’t win, they lose.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 5:11 PM EST up reply actions
that makes sense
My issue with their one “singling” race was that it was such a longshot that it seems odd that they did not hedge by adding the favorite to that race. It just did not seem realistic that if they went to the trouble and expense to include all of the other picks (with at least two horses in every other race), they would bet solely on one longshot in the one race when they could have added a safe pick in that one race.
I hear you
but adding one horse to your pick six ticket doubles the cost of the ticket. To get the cost of the bet, you simply multiply each horse in each race ( 3 × 2 × 3, etc…) and then take that total x $2. Part of putting together a ticket is trying to find logical/cost benefit situations where if you are right, you are going to eliminate most of the other players who have tickets. If for example, 4 out of the 6 races were won by favorites, then you might have 200-300 players with winning tickets. That 2 million payday would get chopped up from lifetime changing score to merely a nice pay day. Most pro players have at least one race where they single a race. It’s by no means a perfect analogy, but its a little bit like buying $500 worth of lottery tickets. It’s a long shot to begin with, you have to hedge and whittle it down to manageable because even the best players aren’t going to hit more than one or two pick sixes a year. And those aren’t likely to be of the million dollar pay off variety.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 6:27 PM EST up reply actions
I hear you too
I would think there would be some strategy to include favorites with longshots because it would at least serve to get your money back.
yeah. . .boardwalk empire was really slow the first few episodes
and it is awesome…i hope luck is really good…can never have enough good tv to watch
that whole pick 6 concept seemed really strange to me…i’ll watch the first episode again before i harass you with any questions about it
j/k: I’d have to watch Deadwood twice to figure out what the hell was going on, so multiple posts help, too.
I never really gambled much on horses
But I do like the chick from Rome who is the jockey. HBO always seems to recast.
It's a bit of a hack line, the "get used to the view," i.e., I'll be in front of you so enjoy staring at my ass
quote she uses when she’s verbally jousting with the other jockey (real life HOF jockey Gary Stevens) as she works out Nolte’s horse in the morning. But my, what a view.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
HBO always seems to recast.
where the fuck is mcnulty?
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 6, 2012 3:54 PM EST up reply actions
On The Hour on BBC
Haven’t seen it yet. It’s supposed to be awesome.
Sporadically musing on the Royals at both Royals Review and Royalscentricity, pop culture at Inconsiderate Prick, SVU at Munch My Benson and on Twitter at Old Man Duggan
by Old Man Duggan on Feb 6, 2012 8:59 PM EST up reply actions
As far as gambling is concerned
horse racing or poker have to be considered the most intellectually challenging. Betting on pro and college sports is also difficult, but I’d say its a tad easier. Most guys don’t do much research at all when laying down cash on football games, which is fairly reckless is you value your money. Table games, slots, and the like, are for rubes or a lark. In horse racing (and poker), you are playing your opinion and analysis against other gamblers, not the house. There isn’t the same built in probability working against you, as there is in keno, craps, slots, blackjack, etc….It is possible to find an angle that the rest of the bettors have overlooked or under estimated. When you are right in these situations, its seriously gratifying. Like figuring out a puzzle, and receiving a cash prize.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 3:55 PM EST reply actions
Thanks for doing this
I watched the pilot but have not watched the second episode yet — this is one show that I might need to wait a few weeks so I can watch several epidsodes in a row and reduce the frustration of not quit knowing what is going on. I am one of the big Deadwood fans here and even made it through most of John Cincinnati.
I kind of like shows that throw the viewer into the deep end of the pool rather than a conventional pilot in which everything is spoon fed through awkward dialogue. What was frustrating here though was that it was difficult to hear the dialogue clearly — so much of the dialogue was mumbled (basically everything Nick Nolte or the trainer said) or when characters were talking over each other (basically every scene with the pick six group or Hoffman) or themselves (everything Richard Kind said).
The one thing I did not get from the pilot — why exactly did the security guard not bet on the pick six after extracting them from the Iron Eagle kid.
i gathered that he didnt like that the fact that there was only 1 pick in one of the races
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 6, 2012 4:29 PM EST up reply actions
It was a $700 something bet
I got the impression that he didn’t think much of the Iron Eagle Kid (nice!), since he was apparently loaning him money all the time and having to chase him down for small amounts. Any pick six ticket is just about like hitting the lottery. It would have been one thing for him to bet $20 on a longshot in one race, quite another to bet $700 in a pick six, in which you need to catch the winner in every race to win the bet.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 5:14 PM EST up reply actions
Good insight on the 1 pick in one race as a possible reason why security guard didn't get down
$700 is a lot to wager when it could all go down the shitter on a race in which you have only one way out. The inspired part of “singling” that horse was that it had been away from the races for over a year, hadn’t shown much in workouts, etc….the only redeeming factor was that Iron Eagle Boy had figured out Escalante might be trying hide the true value/health/potential of that horse, and inflate the odds. In real life, almost every horse that big name trainers enter get bet pretty hard, which drives the odds down and lowers the payout. It’s certainly part of the game to “darken” a horses form, in an effort to get a better price down the road. So a trainer might enter a horse in 2 or 3 races in which it has no shot at winning. And then enter it in a race it can win (when it is coming off what looks like 3 uninspiring efforts), and thats when the trainer would make a bet. Which is what Escalante does. I can’t remember the actual tickets, but I think he cashed somewhere in the neighborhood of 40k on that horse. This is also why he was riding that jockey’s ass for “running his mouth.” If the jockey is running around saying he’s on a live mount, word will travel fast. Rumors from jockeys to trainers to the grandstand are so numerous and indecipherable, most serious handicappers pay no attention to them. They could be a double cross folded back on a triple cross intertwined with a misheard word.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 5:30 PM EST up reply actions
why were they so worried about cashing their winning ticket in?
why would they wait until later to do it? why stay anonymous
Fire Everyone
from what I could tell amid the mumbling
the worry about cashing the ticket was that everyone but the guy they added right before the pick had IRS liens, so they added him to be the public face in an effort to avoid the IRS. I am not quite sure the reason for the delay — maybe they did not have accounts set up to take their splits of the money.
correct....IRS takes money right off the top
if you have a big winning ticket (generally over $600 bucks), you have to “sign” for it, and you get an official form (W-2G) that you are supposed to report as earnings on your tax return. its fairly common to give some drunk at the track $50 to sign for you, and collect your bet. Then you don’t have to report it. The drunk supposedly does. Not your concern at that point. I doubt the guys in Luck did this, they prob just wanted some time to sort all that shit out, considering they were splitting the winning ticket. ALSO, the track can be a rough place. Just like you wouldn’t necessarily want to walk around a casino or a poker room with hundreds of thousands of dollars in hour pocket, same thing (maybe worse) at the track. Most joints will escort you to your car if you nail a big one. Also, you’d have every loser pestering your for loans, tips, or worse for the next 10 years.
Mumbling was an issue. I’ve been using the closed caption stuff for years just to pick up dialogue on most HBO series that I’ve watched.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 5:19 PM EST up reply actions
For what ever reason
Horse Racing gives me the creeps. I can’t quite explain it but I just don’t get it. I’ve been temped to watch the show because HBO is on a real hot streak right now and the cast is amazing but I just can’t get over my weird, albiet arbitrary dislike of horse racing…
The name of that song played at KC Comets games in the '80's was Giorgio Moroder's "The Chase." Now you know.
yeah...im not into it either....
but i’ll give everything hbo makes a shot
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 6, 2012 4:45 PM EST up reply actions
LIke lots of stuff, its an acquired taste.
The more you know, the more you’ll probably like it. In Lincoln, its a great hang. Late spring/summer nights at the track up at the fairgrounds usually have 3-5k people up there, typically a younger crowd. Try reading Jay Cronley on ESPN’s horse racing page. He does it up about as good as anyone, re: horse race culture + handicapping insights. Andy Beyer covers horse racing for the Washington Post, he’s very good as well. And of course, you can’t go wrong with Pavement drummer Bob Nastanovich, who sidelines for the Daily Racing form and actually covers the races up in Des Moines at Prairie Meadows.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 5:22 PM EST up reply actions
At one point Bob owned some horses in Kenucky, I think. He used to have a Derby party every year, according to the slow century DVD.
"You're like that guy who wrote that thing about remembering stuff!!"
- Crow T. Robot
Devaney?
Didn’t know that. Wait, you maybe meant Bobcat Goldthwaite.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 6:28 PM EST up reply actions
Of course Nasty owned horses.
I actually traded some emails with him about horsey stuff at one point back in the 90s. He referred to his trainer as the “red headed cock sucker”.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 6:33 PM EST up reply actions
Very intrigued
But I don’t have HBO.
I have a nostalgic/romantic like for horse racing.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
This show has too much horse ass in it for me to watch
The whole “horses are beautiful creatures with whom certain people can have a spiritual connection” really, really annoys the fuck out of me.
I also hate whales and dolphins.
This show is probably good. I watched the first episode and was intrigued, but at some point I expected some man/horse lovin’ to occur. Nick Nolte looked like he wanted to do some deep-throat kissing with a horse at one point.
I expect the voters are chomping at the bit, as it were, to give it the “best cinematography” award at the emmys the first chance they get.
"You're like that guy who wrote that thing about remembering stuff!!"
- Crow T. Robot
We have a hard on to mythologize in this country.
Maybe NASCAR is one of the few sports that doesn’t suffer from the mist of nostalgia, the overly important Jim Nance manly hoarse whisper voice over about the green jacket, etc..faux baseball reverence rubs me a bit wrong as well. The thing about Luck is that they have actual gamblers. the lifeblood of the sport. GRIT. It ain’t seabiscuit. or Top Gun.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 6:31 PM EST up reply actions
As a non-horse guy
I actually liked the contrast between the horses displayed as noble and “beautiful creatures” and the people displayed as the dregs of humanity.
That said, Nick Nolte creeped me out too.
When I was watching the pilot,
I was thinking, “Goddammit, where’s Nighthawk when I need him.”
Sporadically musing on the Royals at both Royals Review and Royalscentricity, pop culture at Inconsiderate Prick, SVU at Munch My Benson and on Twitter at Old Man Duggan
alright...what the fuck was happening
with the claiming of escalante’s horse. why would he put him up to be claimed if he wasnt willing to lose him?
Fire Everyone
Most tracks run 10 races 4 or 5 days a week
the bulk of those races are “claiming” races, which means that any horse running in that race can be bought or “claimed” by anybody with a racing license. Escalante was bluffing. He didn’t think anyone would be willing to put in a claim on a horse that had just won at a higher level, and then was entered a week later at a lower level. Your question nails it directly: why would he put him up if he didn’t want to lose him? Most would assume he was trying to get rid of the horse. If your bluff succeeds, you pick up an easy score in purse money.
Escalante ran that horse in a race with other horses who had a claiming price of 20k, and the horse won going away, you’d typically expect to see him run again next time against the same level of comp, or maybe a half a step or two above where he just won. You’d be a little skeptical if that horse was entered back in a race for 10k, or half the price, just a week later (most horses need at least 2 or 3 weeks between races, good ones that are more than every day meal tickets typically go 5 weeks between starts). Escalante further tried to bluff by putting front wraps on the horses front legs….kind of like ace bandages? This usually indicates the horse might be sore, or suffering from some nagging injury. In any case, a horse you prob wouldn’t want to claim or buy. Or it could be just to give that impression, and the horse is actually fine. I know guys who won’t bet a horse that is wearing front wraps.
Claiming races are a tool that forces owners/trainers to run their horses against similar competition, because if you enter one at a level lower than its true ability, just to try and poach some easy money, someone is probably going to put a claim on it…happens at big tracks all the time. Escalante didn’t want to lose the horse. He didn’t think anyone in their right mind would be putting in a claim. Most horsemen would assume the horse was injured, or had shot its wad winning the race the week before. The only reason Renzo put in the claim was because it was the horse they singled in the Pick Six, so it was flukey sentimental reasoning. Escalante was trying to steal the purse money for a claiming race, which at the lower levels at Santa Anita, would amount to 25k or so, of which the winner would drag down 65% of that total, so what, approx 15k? A nice score. Unless your bluff gets called. Part of the intrigue of horse racing is trying to figure out that puzzle of what is the horse doing entered in today’s race? Is he meant well, or is it some other chicanery? This type of shit doesn’t really happen during big races like the Derby, Derby preps, Breeders Cup races, etc….you can generally assume everyone is on go legitimately, its only on the undercard filler where the claiming game and reading the tea leaves enters in. Kind of like poker.
When Nolte wasn’t trying to fuck his horse, did you catch him mumbling that some bluebloods in Kentucky killed his horsey’s daddy for insurance money? I’m assuming that is based in part on the suspicious death of Alydar, who ran second in all the Triple Crow races to the last TC winner, Affirmed, in 1978. It was in the early 90s, Alydar was towards the end of his stud career, and he was found one morning with a busted leg and had to be humanely destroyed. Insurance money bonanza. Big scandal. I don’t think anyone got popped for anything legally untoward, but it stank.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 6, 2012 11:09 PM EST up reply actions
thanks...that makes more sense now....
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 6, 2012 11:34 PM EST up reply actions
Jesus Goddamn Christ,
That’s a lot to infer.
Sporadically musing on the Royals at both Royals Review and Royalscentricity, pop culture at Inconsiderate Prick, SVU at Munch My Benson and on Twitter at Old Man Duggan
by Old Man Duggan on Feb 7, 2012 3:53 AM EST up reply actions
I know, it's fucking nuts. It took me two or three years of hitting the track fairly consistently on Saturday afternoons
a lot of money, scotch and waters, studying racing forms, and the like, to begin to get my arms around that rubik’s cube. I think the characters are compelling enough that viewers can hook in w/out having to realize the intricacies of what’s going on…..Treme was like that a little bit.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 7, 2012 8:09 AM EST up reply actions
Watched episode 2 last night
It was a little easier to follow what was going on this week. You could tell they made some tweaks between the pilot and this episode — for example, Richard Kind was about half as manic this time, and conversations between characters were more isolated.
On the claiming race, the bids only come into play if that horse wins, right? Does the owner at least get the money paid by the claimant?
Owner gets the full price paid by claimant. Any horse can be claimed, not just the winner.
If the race conditions indicate its a $10,000 claimer, then all the horses are “for sale” or available for claim for 10k. In episode two, Renzo and another trainer (Dougherty from Deadwood!) both had claims on Escalante’s horse. To determine who gets the horse, they “shake” for it, which basically means they roll dice to see who gets it. They did tone down Kind, thank God. That’s a fine line their walking with him. They probably overplayed Escalante’s anger at losing the horse via a claim. Maybe speaks more to his temper and fierce Kendall like grit than him being extremely surprised at having the horse claimed. They also alluded to the fact that if you submit the claim, and the horse breaks down or breaks its leg during the race, you still pay for it, i.e., you still lose your claim money.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 7, 2012 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks, I think am starting to get it
I am still not quite buying some of the character’s motivations — it would seem the horse’s performance in the previous week would have called a lot of attention to that horse, especially given its trainer and the fact that he was downplaying the horse before the previous race. Escalante seems too sharp of a character to think that track regulars would not be suspicious if he ran the horse again so soon, in a race with a much lower claiming amount, and with the wrapping. While a complete novice on the subject of horse racing, it still seems too much.
It is a little much. You are spot on. But the fact that the horse ran so good, and then was entered for a lower price
would send up a lot of red flags and scare most potential claims away. I have a hard time buying the seething anger. The claim is always a possibility. Another factor in real life, which will be interesting to see if they get to in Luck, is the drug angle. Some trainers have a rep for taking broken down horses, being able to rest it a little, drug it up a little, and then win 3 or 4 races with the horse and try to get rid of it before it is totally fried. It’s kind of like PED’s, some trainers have figured a way around the relatively lax testing rules. Or the penalties aren’t harsh enough to cause much difference. The guy who trained Big Brown, Richard Dutrow, has been nailed several times. Same with Jeff Mullins on the west coast. The racing form has stats that show how each trainer performs with horses “the first time after a claim,” and some of these trainers have 20 or 30 percent win rates. Makes you wonder what they see, or what they do to get dramatic turnarounds.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 7, 2012 5:32 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, but Treme falls into the trap of white guys trying to extol the tragedy of another struggling culture.
By their very nature they’re outsiders, but they try to tell us other white folk why these people are so great. It comes across as pandering and a little weak.
That, and nothing happens. My favorite joke about the show was someone (I wish I could remember who) tweeted something to the effect of:
The Killing tries to become the first show to never have anything but twists while Treme is attempting to be the first show never to have a single twist.
Basically, the show seems to slipshod to be able to resonate in any way, shape, or form and instead tries to fill its narrative shortcomings with 15 minutes of live music every episode, which sadly is not compelling television.
Sporadically musing on the Royals at both Royals Review and Royalscentricity, pop culture at Inconsiderate Prick, SVU at Munch My Benson and on Twitter at Old Man Duggan
by Old Man Duggan on Feb 8, 2012 12:23 AM EST up reply actions
ive so far refused to watch a single second of treme b/c bunk from the wire wont shut up about a bunch of bullshit about NO
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 8, 2012 12:51 AM EST up reply actions
Just unfollow him and watch the show.
Or don’t. The show is frankly not that good. It just seems to me that the issue you have could have been easily resolved with the click of a button.
Sporadically musing on the Royals at both Royals Review and Royalscentricity, pop culture at Inconsiderate Prick, SVU at Munch My Benson and on Twitter at Old Man Duggan
by Old Man Duggan on Feb 8, 2012 1:05 AM EST up reply actions
you are correct...i started following when i was planning on watching the show...
however, he annoyed me before i got around to it. and i think the annoying things he talks about are the basis for the show, so it probably wouldnt work. i dont know why he cant be like everyone else on twitter and just talk about the wire all the time
Fire Everyone
by billybeingbilly on Feb 8, 2012 8:33 AM EST up reply actions
OMD, I recognize some validity in the nature of your bitch about Treme
But you are playing a little rough. Treme often reads as more of a travelogue straight from the heart of the New Orleans Vistor’s and Convention Bureau than an HBO teledrama. However, I prefer watching Simon’s noodling and meandering navel gazing character study about one of the last true regional cultures in New Orleans to approx 98% of the alternatives available to me via my satellite dish 3000 tronamatic. Among the 2%, International House Hunters, Holmes on Homes, Anthony Bourdain, and Andy Griffith re-runs. Simon wouldn’t have had to do Treme if it weren’t for Applebee’s and Clear Channel applying the vanilla memory wipe to food and music alternatives across the country, nay, the world. And Jeopardy. I’ll watch me some Jeopardy. Maybe a little Wheel with my daughter to…..its on at 6:30 on channel 10. Makes for a good digestive experience after suppoer. Pluse, Pat Sajak is really kind of a bitter and cynical asshole when you bore thru the smarmy smiling surface shit. His hatred for most of the contestants is only partially concealed.
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 8, 2012 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks for keeping this thread alive, nighthawk
I’m a degenerate horse racing guy… love to bury myself in a racing form. I love the show so far. It’s only going to get better. To those with DVR’s that don’t quite understand the horse racing vernacular: Watch a second time. I had to, in order to get through some mumbling and Escalante’s thick accent. I’ve always been fascinated by the vast differences in people at the track… rich, high society types alongside drug addicts and hobos. I hope the continue to play these people off one another. A great show, and highly recommended.
Good to see another degenerate....are you an Oaklawn Park guy by any chance?
I can identify with where you are coming from. I’ve always found that mix betwen the low-lifes and the swells a particularly interesting thing about the track. About the only “big” race I’ve ever seen was a G3 over at Prairie Meadows. Watching Baffert and Thom Amoss in $1,000 suits in the paddock, and owners in even more expensive suits, and those G3 horses with coats like polished wood (I’m not a guy who can spot things by the way a horse looks, or walks, or confirmation type stuff, but I could def notice a diff between the way the stakes horses looked compared to the usual stock at Prairie Meadows) , and then toothless gamblers in the seats, college kids, and everything in between…..it’s a setting that seems particularly well suited as a backdrop for books, movies, etc….
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 8, 2012 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I always get down to Hot Springs
at least once per year. I’ve been going during the Rebel Stakes for the last several years. Grade 2 prep for Derby hopefuls. Baffert is usually there. It’s about five hours away from my home, or I’d go more. Enjoy the series! And good luck on the ponies.
Hey, same to you. Good luck on the Derby trail.
If you see anything you like, give me a heads up. My grandpa used to hang out with Terry Wallace back in the day when Terry was the announcer at AkSarBen…I see he’s retired, but I’ve heard lots of good stories about Terry, Wayne Lucas, the Van Bergs, the Von Hemel’s, etc….
by Nighthawk at the Diner on Feb 8, 2012 4:52 PM EST up reply actions
I don't argue that there aren't merits to the show,
but as a whole it is woefully incomplete storytelling. When measured against The Wire or Generation Kill, it comes up woefully short and largely masturbatory. It just seems that 75% of the show is driven by white guilt, which results in a deification and idealization of an art form not unlike that done by the Lomax clan. Sure there’s value to it all, but it tends to get blown way out of proportion (i.e. Robert Johnson, whose influence during his time was nominal at best and was blown up well after the fact by Anglos) as white people inevitably ruin everything.
I’ve seen every episode and will continue on down its path because I do like New Orleans, but Treme is littering with massive amounts of tedium.
Sporadically musing on the Royals at both Royals Review and Royalscentricity, pop culture at Inconsiderate Prick, SVU at Munch My Benson and on Twitter at Old Man Duggan
by Old Man Duggan on Feb 9, 2012 7:53 PM EST up reply actions
I loved Generation Kill.
Really wish that had more film.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
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