Sisco No Mo'

by royalsreview on Dec 16, 2006 2:13 PM EST in News Comment 31 comments

The Royals have traded Andy Sisco to the White Sox for Ross Gload.

I guess its appropriate that we've already established the annual Andy Sisco/Mark Quinn Award in his name, for the Royal player who most fails to live up to his promise. Thanks again to "DaveYork" for that idea.

Driving through Illinois on my way to the annual Royals Review Corporate Retreat I heard praise for this idea, as the White Sox think Sisco is another live arm than Don Cooper can fix.

Thanks to "BerroaistheDevil" and "RockChalkTalk" for the heads up in the diaries. Luckily RR found a wireless internet before the news got too old.

More White Sox reaction at South Side Sox. Gload stats at baseball-reference.

--------

Official Way Too Early Royals Review Analysis

-Dayton continues, rightly or wrongly, to shape the team in his image. Sisco was an Allard success, then failure.

-The downside is that Sisco turns good again in Chicago. We all know he has the potential to make that happen.

-I'm not sure what the Royals need Ross Gload for. He'll be 31 next season and is yet another 1B/DH type. I like him as far as backup/bench/supposedly great "clubhouse guys" go. But I don't immediately see the point, other than further burying Huber. And yes, I know Huber isn't even a 1B anymore.

Did you know Gload finished 7th in the 2004 Rookie of the Year voting? That was the season Greinke finished 4th and DeJesus finished 6th.

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Comments

Huh?

I don't know why we made this deal. The Burgos one at least made sense. Ross Gload is a good bench guy, but when if ever are we going to give Justin Huber a chance. He's the same player just younger and better Especially when trading with the White Sox,they have so much pitching depth why not try to get a pitcher. I would've liked to see Sisco in Omaha for a year and bring him up for 2008 team. Oh well, what do I know? This is the only move GMDM has made so far that I don't understand.

lordbyronk

by lordbyronk on Dec 16, 2006 2:34 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

This has to be Moore just cleaning house.

because this does not make baseball sense to me. Trade a really young pitcher with a ton of potential who was rushed to the majors, for a 31 year old guy who probably won't play more than 40 games for the Royals? This just seems like same old Royals to me.

by monkeybad on Dec 16, 2006 2:47 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Poor return

There just doesn't seem to be any reason for the Royals to obtain Gload. Maybe they think he'll be easier to trade than was Sisco? I doubt that. Gload just doesn't seem to have a role on this team.

I'm sure More was just looking for something in return for a player he had already decided he didn't want on the 2007 roster. Still, Gload seems like a pointless acquisition. Especially since Sicso could have been left in Omaha next year without exposing him to a waiver claim.

Thumbs down on this one at this point. Is it possible that Sweeny is going to be moved soon and this was a CYA move in preparation? Just a wild thought as I try to make sense of the trade.

by James Quinn on Dec 16, 2006 3:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Count me confused

This is one trade that I can not make sense of. Let's see if I get it right? The Royals, who are in serious need of acquiring as many young pitchers as possible, trade a young left hander who considerable upside who has options left. Sisco was an underachiever in 2006 to be sure but he is worth taking a chance on for the future.

In return, they get a 31 year old bench player who plays the same position that KC is overstocked in already. If you were Justin Huber, what message is being sent to you? Guess we needed someone to take the place of Matt Stairs. Nothing against Gload but I hope he finds some playing time among the mix of DeJesus, Brown, Sanders, Gathright, Maier, Costa, Huber, Lubanski, Butler and Teahen. Well, maybe he'll get some ABs at DH with Sweeney, Sanders, German or maybe 1B with Ryan Shealy being there.

I would love to hear the reasoning behind this one besides "we need to strengthen our bench."

by daveyork on Dec 16, 2006 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Breaking down Gload

Breaking down Gload, 13th round draft choice by the Marlins in 1997. He has been a consistently good bat in the minors, moving up a level each year until he made the major leagues in 2000 at the age of 24 for a cup of coffee. His only truly great year was 2000 when he hit 31HR's, 75XBH and drove in 107 combined over AA, AAA and MLB.

It looks like his bat has been good enough to move him up each year, but never good enough to win him a starting job as a 1B/Dh on a major league roster. His career MLB numbers are .298/.343/.437/.780 over 494AB (12HR, 74RBI's.) Pretty good numbers overall, but I a step below what you look for out of this position. He is out of options, and signed for next year already at $625K. He cannot be sent down without risking an almost certain waiver claim. So he is on the 25 man roster and must stay there or be lost.

His problem seems to be his plate discipline. Not a huge number of K's (14% of PA), but he doesn't draw walks at a good rate (6%) so his overall ratio is .436 (BB/K). He either needs to fix this and become Todd Heltonesque, or bulk up and become Paul Kenerkoesque, or settle for #23 man on the roster and 200 PA's per year. I don't see him pushing Shealy for the 1B job, but he might give Emil Brown a bit of pressure at DH when Mike "faberge egg" Sweeny goes into aching back mode. Who knows, since this is Sweeney's last year on his contract maybe God will finally see fit to cure him of his ach so he can sign one more big deal before hanging up his cleats.
I can see no reason to put Gload on the team over Huber and/or Butler as either of them probably could deliver as much if not more next year with the bat as the Royals will likely receive from Gload.

In 10 years Florida, Cubs, Colorado, and the White Sox have each given up on Gload. Maybe it will be different in KC, but if so, his emergence will be a completely random event. At 31 years of age, Gload probably is what he is. A decent but not great bat. A less lovable Matt Stairs, or maybe a poor man's Todd Helton.

by James Quinn on Dec 16, 2006 4:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It was just pointed out to me

that this makes a little more sense if we plan on trading Huber. Although, considering what we did to him last year, I'm not sure how we could plan to get much more than Cisco in return...

by monkeybad on Dec 16, 2006 4:20 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Puzzled

I dont really know what to say.

I liked Andy, 6-10 monsters like that don't come around every day. I really really really would have liekd to see him in AAA this season. Regardless of what "regime" brought him in, I don't think you can ignore what he did as rule 5er.

The only thing I can guess would be, Moore really really likes Soria, and plans on using him out of the pen, and didn't think Sisco would have as much value. I imagine Gload can fill some value, as a bench player with versatility and some pop, something we don't really have anymore since Stairs is gone.

Will Sisco be worth of an honorary page? One of the best memories I have of him, and maybe you all remember, was Opening Day 2005. Of course that was the Dmitri Young 3HR, Jose Lima debacle, but later in the game, the 21 Year old, 6-10 manchild was thrown in to the fire much to the surprise of Royals fans. He did pretty well in that game, and in that season.

Best of Luck Mr Sisco, hopefully our paths will cross again some day.

by wildthang on Dec 16, 2006 4:33 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

yeah...

and then remember the Yankees home opener when he blew that lead...and there went our season...I contend if we put the Yankees down in their home opener we would of won 5-8 more games

Buy the ticket, take the ride.

by PhattStairs on Dec 17, 2006 1:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I have been trying to put

a positive spin on this one but it has been hard. The only thing I can think of is that Moore plans to keep all the AA players at AAA next season and Gload is backup for Sweeney at DH, Shealy at 1B, Brown in LF, and Sanders in RF. That is if there aren't any other trades.

I agree with LordB that I would have like to see Sisco in AAA for another year and then be brought up. The Royals took him from the Cubs AA and plunked at the K. He needed more time. Maybe the Sox will give it to him. Williams is really stockpiling arms on that team too.

Gload is a surprise. He didn't make it with the Cubs as Dusty didn't like his swing and other things. He was always a backup for the Sox. I hope Moore has a plan.

by grudz69 on Dec 16, 2006 5:37 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Let the spin begin

Read on the White Sox blog a comment from Dayton Moore. "Gload is a hard nosed, tough minded player who battled his way through the minors." It won't be long before he is "good in the club house, a professional, has a good work ethic, does the little things right, is a gamer, has a grind it out manner." Wait until the spin begins. What I can't understand is if this is the type of player that KC admires and respects, what the heck is Angel Berroa still doing around? Maybe he'll get traded for another back up OF/1B/DH.

Maybe that is the part of the trade I don't like. Is Sisco is as much of a screw up as I have read, perhaps they are better off without him? Couldn't we have gotten a backup SS for him? With the state of pitching in the majors, is Ross Gload the best we could do as far as needs of the team?

by daveyork on Dec 16, 2006 7:42 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Hopefully another deal coming shortly

for either Huber or Sweeney. I'd love to see us get some value for Huber. I suppose we need some backup at 1B, but they said Teahen was going to take some balls at 1B as backup. Really hard to figure, although I don't think Sisquatch will ever amount to much. Still, absent another move would have liked a more useful player in return, like a SS prospect.

by chukar on Dec 16, 2006 7:53 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Here's a funny story from Neyer's web

"A little over two weeks ago, I got an email forwarded to me by Paul Swydan, one of our BP interns, from a gentleman named Bruce Baskin, who apparently writes a newsletter on Mexican baseball. Here's a copy of that email:"

"Check this out: Andy Sisco, the 6'9" kid from Eastern Washington who pitches for the Royals, was just cut by Mazatlan. He was pitching well enough, however the team director saw Sisco munching on a couple of tacos in the stadium concourse...during the first inning of a game. Apparently, he showed up in the dugout sometime in the second, but his fate was sealed.

"What a bonehead! Hadn't he been down there long enough to figure they take the game a whole lot more seriously in Mazatlan than they do in Omaha? Hope he got his tacos to go."

Guess that explains why he hadn't pitched for a while down there, and explains this move as well. Consistent with trimming the fat literally(Hernandez, who I thought cornered the Royal market on taco consumption). I like the move better now. Get the lousy attitude with poor work ethic out the door (including Burgos). If you set aside the need issue, which addmitedly is tough to do right now, Gload is a decent return for Sisco. Solid hitter, especially off bench, with defensive flexibility.

by chukar on Dec 16, 2006 10:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Huber will never be out of the Blue doghouse...

Never... so, Gload may be what we need when Sweeney goes down and Sanders, Brown, and anyone else are on the injured list. He is not a starter and Sisco would have been at Omaha anyway. So... I am taking this trade with a large cup of salt.

The five year Meche thing bothers me more...

by grudz69 on Dec 17, 2006 12:35 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Cleaning house with a purpose

I said last week that I think we're underestimating GMDM, and to do so on this, truly a minor move, would be mistaken. Especially after reading the quote sent to Rany referenced above, this move is just like cutting Hernandez. At first, I was as confused as everyone else, but if Sisco is a head case, then its unlikely that he'll EVER be the pitcher we hoped he would be (which may be why the Cubs let him go in the first place). I think Sisco was always one of those guys Buddy, Elarton, et al. were talking about when talking about non-major league attitudes on the roster. Potential without commitment does not lead to success---it leads to sitting in a LazyBoy for the rest of your life talking drinking beer talking about "the time I made it to the show," even if that was simply because you were on the team with the shallowest pitching system in the league.

I also favor the "Gload means more deals in the future" approach. Neither Huber nor Emil open the season in the Royals organization, Maier and Costa may not as well, and Butler and Lubanski are in Omaha. Assuming that Gordon starts in KC, that's Teahen, Reggie, DDJ, and Gathright for the outfield, Shealy at 1B, and Sweeney at DH. Essentially, Gload is Matt Stairs, only younger, more athletic and with a better batting average.

by CentralChamps2009 on Dec 17, 2006 12:38 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Cleaning House

I agree, GMDM is cleaning house of all the crappy attitudes that the Royals have had the past couple of years. I agree with others that said that this is just like cutting Fat Elvys, it is just clearing space and this deal is a little better because we got a real major league bat for him. Gload is probably going to be one of our most solid bench players, and as has been discussed we were, for the first time in a long time, scrambling for spots for all of the pitchers that need to fill them. This takes one more pitcher out of the running so a more deserving pitcher makes it.

Also, I sure hope that another trade follows this one, preferrably one for Sanders or Sweeney but Emil Brown and Justin Huber would be fine as well especially because we could get more for them. Gload is basically the 5th OF and backup 1B if we trade two of those, which GMDM will find a way to do. The difference between GMDM and Allard is that GMDM has a plan and sticks to it in all of his deals. Even though he is trying to stockpile young arms, Sisco had major attitude problems and I'm just happy we got anything for him. I do think that we might have been able to get more than Gload for him but maybe not, maybe everyone not named Kenny Williams knew that he is going to waste his talent anyways.

by rockchalk on Dec 17, 2006 12:54 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Gload put up same OPS as Brown last year

our second best hitter, and presumably brings more defensively. I'd rather see Gload in our OF than Brown or Sanders. Again, hopefully this means we're moving a couple of Sweeney/Huber/Brown/Sanders/Sweeney.

My only concern is blocking Costa. We need to see what he can do. He becomes an obvious trade possibility as one of Allard's guys. I like the way DM is remaking the team with an eye toward professionalism. In addition to losing, part of our reputation prolem was that our young players were undisciplined and didn't appreciate being in the big leagues.

by chukar on Dec 17, 2006 8:21 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Additional Trades?

Do you think maybe the Royals might have renewed interest in Rodirigo Lopez from Baltimore. I wonder if Baltimore would part with Hayden Penn as well. The Royals could offer Emil Brown and Justin Huber in return. It would seem to fill a need for both teams and give each team a player with considerable upside. I could just be dreaming here. I also would hate to see Costa road blocked. I really think he should be our fourth outfielder next year.

lordbyronk

by lordbyronk on Dec 17, 2006 1:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

people have tried to tell me Costa is good...

but I see him as not being in the majors in 5 years...he just seems like he has peaked already by watching him...I think maybe he has a very professional attitude, but he doesn't have enough power to be a corner outfielder...we already have DDJ with defensive/speed backup Gathright...only thing bothers me about this Sisco trade is that its like GMDM has no faith in management to actually develop these players right...but maybe thats a good thing, I always thought Bobby Cox was a lump of coal that just coached more intelligent athletes so he didn't really have to do anything except collect coach of the year awards...plus I like this guys name GLOAD it cracks me up...let the endless puns begin

Buy the ticket, take the ride.

by PhattStairs on Dec 17, 2006 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Gload

You guys might be undervaluing this guy. He's not a Ken Phelps All-Star, but he's a much better hitter than people have given him credit for.

This is kind of like (and bear with me on this one) the Orioles trading Chris Britton for Jaret Wright. Yes, the return is just a useful guy--not a great one by any means--but all they gave up was a young, not impressive reliever. Given how fluky relief pitching is--look at Sisco the last two years--I think this is a neat little move.

by NHZ on Dec 17, 2006 12:57 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I agree

Gload can play. And what I saw from Sisco In the games I went to reminded me of R.Hernadez in lack of caring.And our bullpen SUCKED last year and he helped. I only hope more housecleaning is on the way.

by ROR 1Fan on Dec 17, 2006 8:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

curious quote

this from the KC Star:
Other than Shealy, we don't have another first baseman in the organization. (Mike) Sweeney isn't really an option there. (Justin) Huber isn't a guy we feel comfortable with there right now, though we certainly think he can play it." - Dayton Moore

When have they shown any inclination to play Huber at any position?

by buddyball on Dec 18, 2006 12:46 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

thank goodness for royals review

I post on the Royals MB from time to time, and if you suggest that St. Dayton has ever made a bad move, you get treated like a leper.

My take is that Gload could be a pretty decent bat for us. I also don't have a major problem with trading away Sisco, provided it's for a younger solution at middle infield or the rotation (e.g. Burgos-Maine trade).

It just seems that Gload is the type of player we should be trading away, and Sisco is the type of player we should be trading for. Or are we ready for the playoffs already?

by marbotty on Dec 18, 2006 1:40 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

i strongly disagree

with Moore's understanding of how hard it is to find 1Bs

we've now made TWO trades for the easiest position to fill

by royalsreview on Dec 18, 2006 3:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i really just wish...

they'd get rid of huber and we could all move on

by royalsreview on Dec 18, 2006 3:10 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Yes, please!!!

I'm so sick of hearing about all the ways the organization has mistreated poor Justin. Let's just dump him and end everyone's misery.

by chukar on Dec 18, 2006 9:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

27 outs first

This move shows the importance GMDM places on two things difficult to measure and therefore often dismissed even by attentive baseball fans.

Namely, defense and attitude.

GMDM's first principle is that you have to get 27 outs a game to win. You can win [or lose] with one run, or three, or ten but you must get 27 outs to win a regulation game.

His second principle seems to be that attitude & character matter. Without it, players are unlikely to help build a winner long-term.

Just about all of the moves so far have been about getting more outs or getting players with better charcter/work habits.

Consider:

Relievers for starters [more outs]---Burgos, Dessens and MacDougal for Bannister, Perez and Lumsden respectively.

Fading veterans for young pitching---Graffanino and Stairs for de la Rosa and Diaz respectively.

Add to this the fact that the free agent money that's been spent has all been on pitching: Meche/Dotel.

These all fit within the '27 outs first' paradigm.

Sisco for Gload [young pitching for a talented bench/platoon bat] only makes sense when you add in the second element: character, but that's enough. Worth noting that GMDM cited Gload's work habits when answering questions about the trade.

Remember how high we all thought the ceiling was on Runelvys, but does anybody think letting that talented lazy player go for free was a bad thing? Anybody want to bet Sisco goes the weigh of Runelvys over the next few years?

In fact, about the only moves made so far that don't fit into this paradigm are Affeldt/Bautista for Shealy and the Gathright trade.

Affeldt and Bautista were just terrible in CO after the trade so maybe that was based on an assessment of their skills. Meanwhile, Shealy hit pretty well [.783 OPS] and played adequate defense after coming over [3 errors in 51 games at 1B].

And yet, Shealy was our best defensive option at 1B until the Gload acquisition. Add to that, the prospect of Teahen learning a new position at corner OF and the defensively-challenged Emil Brown and the need for a glove/LH bat off the bench becomes apparent, ergo Gload. If in the process, he can dump an attitude problem [Sisco]that seems like just the kind of move GMDM should/would make.

The reluctance to trust Huber/Costa seems to stem from their defensive inadequacies.

The head-scratcher remains Howell for Gathright, not Sisco for Gload.

by howserfan on Dec 18, 2006 6:30 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Well Stated

I agree that character is important and defense and pitching win ballgames. In hindsight, I'm more OK with this trade the more I think about it. GMDM definitely has a concrete plan and that's a step in the right direction.

lordbyronk

by lordbyronk on Dec 18, 2006 6:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i think

first base defense is REALLY overratted

and again, its not so much Gload himself, its that the Royals gave up something to get him

Sisco may be lazy/evil/a tomcat/whatever

but he HAS done well at the major league level and certainly has potential

FIRE BELL

by FireBell on Dec 18, 2006 7:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

how long is gathright locked for???

seems to me no problem dumping howell...for me he had very high value at the time for very little work...my assessment was that he would never pan out(I so wish I was a scout)...so gathright as a defensive/speed guy is perfect a la lofton/nixon except lofton is a stud hitter...only problem is we tried to play him everyday...if we contend gathright will be very valuable...if howell does anything higher than 8 wins with a sub 4.80 era I'll be very surprised...plus trading with Tampa is perfect because players die under bad management/no fans...they just get sucked into the vortex and the trade looks good no matter how bad gathright does...if howell ever pitched with someone like the yankees he might blossom...I doubt it

Buy the ticket, take the ride.

by PhattStairs on Dec 18, 2006 9:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Howserfan:

I kinda agree with your assessment of Dayton; however, there is one player on this team for whom these "rules" apparently don't apply. Berroa is a below average defensive player, and while everybody seems to love his clubhouse demeanor, the fact that he is going to work hard on his flexibility this off-season indicates to me that he lacked the "character" to keep himself in tip-top shape in the first place!

The Royals treatment of Berroa flies in the face of what GMDM seems to be trying to make a statement about, IMHO.

by loyal2s dad on Dec 19, 2006 10:55 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

A Big "But"

No, not another Runelvys joke.

After jettisoning Runny, whom weeks ago was "projected to be in the rotation," I am willing to give DM the benefit of the doubt on Berroa. I don't doubt at all that he'd move him if he could, but there's no market, there wasn't any great answer in free agency, and right now we have no options at SS (man, I wish German was playing SS this winter). I'm willing to give the man time to do with Berroa what should, and I think will, be done.

by CentralChamps2009 on Dec 19, 2006 11:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs