It's official, "Berroa may lose his job." - KC Star

by James Quinn on Mar 22, 2007 9:21 AM EDT Comment 56 comments

From Bob Dutton

"Shortstop Angel Berroa's ongoing struggles have the Royals working overtime to find an alternative. Club officials are believed to have put together of list of 20 or more trade candidates for evaluation and discussion purposes.
No deal appears imminent, but officials with other clubs say the Royals show a growing urgency to make some sort of move before they open the regular season April 2 against Boston at Kauffman Stadium.
General manager Dayton Moore declined to confirm the search beyond saying: "We're always looking for opportunities to make our team better."
The Royals' preference, from all appearances, is to land a utility player capable of playing shortstop until they decide whether minor-league prospect Angel Sanchez represents a viable long-term solution."

Full story link:
http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/sports/baseball/mlb/kansas_city_royals/16949397.htm

"Possible trade targets include Colorado's Clint Barmes and Toronto's John McDonald unless the Royals can pry loose a high-end prospect such as Erick Aybar or Brandon Wood of the Los Angeles Angels."

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Comments

I hope so

I wouldn't mind trading for Barmes. And of course Wood or Aybar is a fun (but unrealistic) dream. But please don't pay a "stiff price" for John McDonald. He is an absolute hack at the plate. He's genuinely not a better hitter than Berroa.

by NYRoyal on Mar 22, 2007 9:36 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

One wild-ass suggestion

Reggie Sanders or Emil Brown to Cincinnati for Juan Castro. Castro makes $1M, is a good defensive SS, plays 3B and 2B also, but will not be an offensive upgrade over Berroa.

The Reds need offense in the outfield (I can't believe I'm writing this one year after they went to camp with Dunn, Kearns, Jr, and Willy Mo Pena in their outfield) and I think Brown or Sanders would make the club. After signing Glovie Gonzo the Reds no longer have need for Castro. It seems like a potentially doable trade that will help both clubs in 2007, but will not be a long term solution for either.

Rock Chalk Talk for pretty good KU College Baseball Coverage

by James Quinn on Mar 22, 2007 9:38 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Perfect

Buy the ticket, take the ride.

by PhattStairs on Mar 22, 2007 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Gathright for Castro

The Reds have Dunn in LF and Whiffey in RF. Emil and Reggie can't play CF, but Gathright can. He'd be a good match in return for Castro.

Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com

by RoyalsRetro on Mar 22, 2007 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Reds plans for CF

I believe the plan the Reds have for CF is starting Freel there, and spelling him with a combination of Chris Denorfia, Josh Hamilton and perhaps Bubba Crosby. Denorfia is much better than Gathright today. Hamilton is Rule-5 with much more potential than Gathright and will need some plate time. Crosby seems to be no good at anything, but seems like he is going to make the roster because Vomit Brain Krivsky gave him and Chad Moeller guaranteed contracts to suck in Cincinnati in 2007. (What? was Bako's phone busy when he wanted to give away $700K for a piece of crap player to cripple his roster?)

The thing about Gathright, he reall can't do anything well enough to hold on to a MLB roster spot and I have very little hope for improvement on his part. I don't see him panning out. He needs to rise his OBP by about 30 points, learn to steal bases at a 70+% sucsess rate, and learn how to read balls hit towards him and become a plus fielder. That is three huge areas in which he needs to improve. Do you see Gathright pulling off this trifecta? And, if he does, what is he? A poor man's Juan Peirre. Not much hope for not much payoff. If someone wants Gathright and offers any value for him I think More should jump at the deal.

I like the Reds taking Sanders or Brown because Griffy will miss 30-100 games, his main back up is old-and-crappy Connie, who also backs up the old-as-hell-and-not-so-good-when-healthy Scott Hatteberg at first. After Dunn and Griffy the Reds have little pop in their outfield. They could use a good bat to play 4th outfielder and pinch hitter. They have Castro for no good reason at all now that Krivsky signed Alex Gonzalez. Castro is not a better fielder than Gonzo, and he can not hit or steal bases. The Reds could swap Castro and his $1M for either Sanders or Brown. They might ask for some cash if they take Sanders. It all seems reasonably possible. I think the trade helps both clubs in 2007, and neither in 2008.

Rock Chalk Talk for pretty good KU College Baseball Coverage

by James Quinn on Mar 22, 2007 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

As I think about this

it probably is not a good move for KC to make as Castro only marginally improves the 2007 club, and in 2008 the Royals basically have the same problem to face once more.

If a short term solution is needed, I think Blanco, Sanchez, Grudz and/or German could be plugged into SS. Blanco improves the defense, but nothing more on offense. Sanchez neither improves the offense or defense, but maybe he has the most potental. Grudz and German are not likely to even maintain Berroa's level of defense, but both will vastly improve the offense. There are in-house solutions that would make the club as competitive as trading for Castro would accomplish.

Boy, Baird sure didn't worry about option-B as shortstop, did he. What were the Royals going to do if Berroa went on long-term DL? Blanco was the answer I suppose.

Rock Chalk Talk for pretty good KU College Baseball Coverage

by James Quinn on Mar 22, 2007 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ding Dong!

The Witch is Dead. Which old Witch? The Wicked Witch! Ding Dong! The Wicked Witch is Dead.

by loyal2s dad on Mar 22, 2007 10:38 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Good News

The bad news is that neither Barmes nor McDonald is a good idea. Barmes had one decent season at Coors field, then collapsed last year to Berroa-like levels. McDonald is a back-up guy.

Getting Aybar would be an idea I'd like to see teams who need a new SS pursue, as he could be a good one. I have a feeling that Wood is not going nowhere.

"Your best? Losers always whine about 'giving it their best.' Winners go home and fuck the prom queen."

"Carla was the prom queen."

by NHZ on Mar 22, 2007 10:45 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Very bad news

What he said. Neither Barmes nor McDonald (McDonald?! WTF?) is worth trading anything of any particular value for.
I'm as happy about the team's finally waking up and realizing that Berroa is a complete stiff as the next guy (and hey, it only took Dayton Moore and "his manager" (per Mr. Goodtimes, JoPo) Buddy Bell how long to figure this out?), but if we're going to dump Berroa and then give up value for another different stiff, how much do we gain?
I really don't know what's worse, the team's waiting till a week and a half before Opening Day to figure out that Berroa isn't a viable major league shortstop, or that they're actually maybe in serious discussions to trade something more than a bottlecap and a skate key for John McDonald or Clint "Can't even put up numbers in Coors" Barmes.
Sure, Manny Aybar would be a very interesting pickup, as would Brandon Wood, but after Aybar's hot spring his value has risen back to where it was goiung into 2006, and hey, did anybody notice that the Angels have already moved Wood to third?
Every time we get to start feeling good with news like "Gordon's our o-fficial starting thirdbaseman," we get smacked back down to Looney Tunes reality. Ain't March a time for sweet dreams?

by Sliver on Mar 22, 2007 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

If Barmes put up Berroa numbers in Colorado...

by marbotty on Mar 22, 2007 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Short-term solutions...

...are all we have to choose from right now. The best we can hope for right now is a trade which provides a modest upgrade. That will probably mean a SS who can field well but can't hit a lick.

We're not going to get Aybar unless we give up a lot. And I don't think we're ready to do that right now. Maybe if Sweeney has had a good, healthy half, the Angels might be willing to move Aybar for him at that time. Maybe.

by NYRoyal on Mar 22, 2007 10:48 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

A more serious response

I'm colder than lukewarm on the Barmes idea. Has everybody already forgotten the last time we traded for a Rockies' shortstop?

Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it...

Surely there are better options among the 20 candidates...

by loyal2s dad on Mar 22, 2007 10:49 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Twins

The Twins are planning to platoon Jeff Cirillo and Jeff Kubel at DH. Reggie could surely outhit Jeff Cirillo. How bout Reggie for SS Alexi Casilla?

I like McDonald and think he has a slick glove, but he can't hit a lick. I'd be fine with that for a year, but we need a more long-term option than that. I think Barmes is probably the only SS worse than Angel. What about Jamey Carroll? I had read he lost his starting 2B job. He was a Gold Glove caliber 2B, he could probably shift to SS without too much trouble.

I really think there's no way we're getting Brandon Wood - he's already moved to 3B to be the 3B of the future. Aybar is possible, but still a long shot.

What are the D-backs going to do with Alberto Callaspo with Stephen Drew blocking him?

Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com

by RoyalsRetro on Mar 22, 2007 10:53 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Please get realistic

All these people who are saying that only Aybar or Woods is acceptable need to take a reality check. Who you think we can possibly get? And what are you willing to give up for him? Getting a top prospect (Like Brandon Wood) would take a top prospect. Feel like trading Billy Butler for Brandon Wood? Didn't think so.

Trading a not top prospect for a stop-gap solution like Barmes wouldn't be crazy. He's a cheap upgrade over Berroa and that would work for the short-term.

If you you've got better, realistic ideas. Please offer them up.

by NYRoyal on Mar 22, 2007 11:50 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

not true

a trade for Wood is possible because the Angels are working on a deal for Alex Rodriguez that involve Jered Weaver and Jose Molina. Wood could come to KC for a variety of things including Justin Huber, Lubanski, Leo Nunez, Joey Gathright or possibly Billy Buckner. Some combination of 2 of those guys is altogether possible. The Angels are facing a PR nightmare because Stoneman promised a "big" bat in the offseason.

royaldaddy-Bob Hamelin's #1 fan

by royaldaddy on Mar 22, 2007 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not realistic

Let's say the A-Rod trade happens.

You think the Royals could get a top 10 prospect (#8 BA, #5 BP) for a few prospects, none of which is even a top 100 prospect in anyone's book? Hey, I'd love it. But the Angels aren't going to just give him away. He's worth a hell of a lot more than that.

by NYRoyal on Mar 22, 2007 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I believe

If we didn't believe before, believe now. GMDM is the man.

by howserfan on Mar 22, 2007 11:52 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I believe

...that it took half a season, an off-season and three-plus weeks of spring training for GMDM to figure out that Berroa sucks and won't work. I wonder if we'd have had to be scrambling around for a possibly expensive, probably only short-term solution if this had been addressed back when it was, oh I dunno, painfully obvious?

I hope that GMDM makes a deal that shuts me up and has me kissing the ground he walks on, but IMO he'd have had a better chance of that months ago when there was no pressure of an impending season dead ahead.

by Sliver on Mar 22, 2007 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Come on

I know we Royals fan love to talk about how bad Berroa is. But I think Dayton Moore has done exactly the right thing with Berroa. Given how much the organization owes him in salary, it has made sense for the Royals to continue to play him. I bet DM explored a variety of options for trading him and/or acquiring another SS. But it isn't that easy. No one wants to talk Berroa for obvious reasons ($$$ and suckage). And getting a good SS requires giving up good talent. We're not going to get a decent major league ready SS for Huber and Maier. That's a nice pipedream, but that's about it.

Given all the money we owe him, it has made sense to at least give Berroa the offseason and to give him a shot to see if he could improve in ST. He hasn't and so now DM is looking for alternatives. Don't pretend that there were all kinds of great opportunities in the offseason to bring in a good SS. Such opportunities simply didn't exist.

by NYRoyal on Mar 22, 2007 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Come on Come on

Hey, we just disagree about sticking with Berroa. I don't believe that Berroa's play the past two seasons merited another chance, much less a pipedream that he was going to miraculously turn around his career. How often does that actually happen, anyway? The dollar investment was the issue, plain and simple. IMO, it should've been written off as a sunk cost and tossed overboard. The Meche signing's cost has been beaten to death, but the money owed Berroa was but a fraction of that, and it apparently didn't break the bank. The money was spent regardless.
I won't (and didn't) pretend that we could get a viable shortstop for nothing. I hope that Moore explored alternatives in the off-season, but that certainly wasn't the line he took in anything he said publicly about it, for what little that's worth. My point was, and is, are we better able to address the situation by trade now, with a gun to our head and having just made ourselves officially desperate, or in the months we've had since DM took over the team? Months in which other teams have had all kinds of chances to decide who made their 40-man rosters and who didn't (for us to maybe grab a guy from) or to sign an unrestricted free agent type or two and make camp an open audition for the position, rather than get this far in to spring and panic because Berroa li9ved down to our expectations?
I don't have time/opportunity to go through the last 5-6 months of Transaction Analyses at BP to throw names out (maybe later), but I bet you that we could've either gone the UFA route or have made a minor tarnished prospect (calling Justin Huber) deal for somebody as good as John freaking McDonald, already. I'm not talking making a major deal for a next few seasons replacement, just making use of the free or nearly free talent that's available to address what we well knew was a major issue for us. Persuade me that March 22 is a better time to make a needs move for a player than December 22. The opportunities more likely existed to find a stopgap solution (which is all Barmes or McDonald are) than you recognize.

by Sliver on Mar 22, 2007 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

When you've got this much money invested...

...in a player, it makes sense to give him a number of chances, particularly when the team is rebuilding and has no reasonable chance of getting to the playoffs. The team would be much better off if that money went a player who had finally put it together than to a player who is now playing for someone else because we released him.

That's why I don't mind that DM didn't DFA him as soon as he became GM. Giving him another offseason and a chance in ST makes sense to me. It's not like we need a good SS for our playoff run this year. We need a stop-gap. Then we can get someone in the offseason, or maybe as part of a mid-season trade this year.

by NYRoyal on Mar 22, 2007 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

No

The money is already a sunk cost. Either

He'll play and suck
He won't play and somebody (at least a little) better will play.

That's the way it is. Blanco may put up a .650 OPS for his career...but that's miles ahead of Berroa, and Blanco's defense is clearly superior, especially in terms of range.

by doublestix on Mar 23, 2007 12:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I know it is a sunk cost

And you can either get something for that money, or get nothing from it.

I'm not saying Berroa should be the SS right now. I'm defending the fact that Moore gave him an offseason and a ST to see if he could get it together. Because him getting it together would have been much better for the Royals than for the team to get nothing for the millions he is owed. It was worth a try.

Given the fact that Berroa hasn't turned anything around and the offseason did him no good, I'm happy that the Royals are exploring other options and I hope that if they don't make any deals, they give the job to Blanco at least for the time being.

by NYRoyal on Mar 23, 2007 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes

That I agree with. I like the fact that Moore gave Berroa a chance this spring. Unfortunately it didn't work out.

I'm ready to move on.

by doublestix on Mar 23, 2007 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreement

I know I'm getting back late, but aftr reading the new stuff I did just want to add my agreement on Blanco. It's clear that the team doesn't think he's viable there, but I'd really like to see him get 150-200 PA's just to see. You could always hit for him in later innings and either use Gonzalez or whoever we might pick up. Plus that gives Moore additional time to explore the market. As far as that goes, the last cuts are coming up and maybe something will shake loose. These end of the camp moves are ythe kind of players that can be had for a reasonable to negligible investment by way of a return player. We've done nothing but trash Justin Huber's value, but I think he's still a chip for this sort of deal.
I still don't think that going into this spring with Berroa made sense, especially because of the position his ongoing failure leaves us in now (ans again, how often does a player with two concecutive years of suckage suddenly turn his career around the next spring?). But we don't have to overpay for a "replacement-level" replacement, or at least I sure hope not.

by Sliver on Mar 23, 2007 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Gotta love McDonald

Since he was traded for himself once

by royalsreview on Mar 22, 2007 11:54 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Create solutions

not add to the problem. Clint Barmes and John McDonald are not the answer. Barmes couldn't hit in DENVER, that should tell you about his starting possiblities. McDonald is a utility player nothing more. Go with a young player trade prospects we won't use longterm (Justin Huber, Mitch Maier, Shane Costa, Joey Gathright), Reggie. Go after players like Erick Aybar, Joaquin Arias, Alexi Castilla, Ryan Theirot, Ronny Cedeno, these are young players with upside. Otherwise, we are better off hoping for a miracle turnaround of Angel Berroa.

lordbyronk

by lordbyronk on Mar 22, 2007 12:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

A sunk cost from all angles

Honestly, I don't see any sure fire solutions for the Royals at this position - either through trades or within the organization. Very few teams have an MLB-ready shortstop that the Royals could acquire for someone they'd be willing to part with. Aybar or Wood would ideal (for both parties) but we have nothing to offer the Angels in return unless we want to flip a top prospect like Hochevar or Butler. Not worth it. Ronny Cedeno? The Cubs would want pitching in return, which we flat out don't have. Barmes has been terrible since he got hurt in '05. Honestly, I'd almost prefer acquiring Kaz Matsui. McDonald never has hit and never will. A trade for Juan Castro? That makes no sense when we already have Alex Gonzalez in camp.

Ideally, something intriguing would be out there in exchange for one half of Reggiemil Brownders and a prospect, but I'm not seeing it right now. In a dreamers world, BJ Upton would be the guy I'd pull for. The Devil Rays gave up on him at shortstop for some reason, and now he's a man without a position, but I've got a gut feeling that he just needs a change of scenery to take off, a la Brandon Phillips. Once again though, what would the Royals offer in return?

In the end, I'm just glad that the Royals are finally willing to consider Berroa as a sunk cost. Unless GMDM can work some serious magic for Aybar/Wood, Cedeno, or Upton without giving up too much in return, I think it's best to DFA Berroa and stay in house.

Neither Gonzalez nor Blanco could be any worse than Berroa, at least for half a season.

by nycroyal on Mar 22, 2007 1:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Other possibility

Go with in house options for now. Hope Sweeney has a healthy half season and deal him to the Angels for Aybar. It helps them get the power bat they need, and the talent at SS we need. Probably wishcasting from a lot of angles, but possible.

lordbyronk

by lordbyronk on Mar 22, 2007 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

How about this blockbuster:

Sweeney, Teahen and possibly a couple of Grade B prospects to the Yankees for A-Rod?

We move A-Rod back to shortstop, and start to address the OF/1B/DH logjam.

Butler makes the team now as a LF/DH (and continues to work on his OF defense some of the games). We grit our teeth and keep Brown and Sanders for one more season, bridging the gap until Lubanski is ready, or if we trade one of Brown/Sanders, there is now room for Costa.

This is attractive to the Yankees because they can move Teahen right back to 3B to replace A-Rod and the media storm he creates.

A-Rod would be happy, because he never really wanted to move off of shortstop, in my opinion. If we're lucky, he even comes equipped with a boulder-sized chip on his shoulder.

Take a look at how our new lineup would look:

DeJesus CF
German DH
A Rodrgiuez SS
Gordon 3B
Butler LF
Shealey 1B
Brown/Costa platoon RF
Grudzielanek 2B
Buck/Larue C

by loyal2s dad on Mar 22, 2007 1:20 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I like it

It only faces a few obstacles:

A-Rod has a no-trade clause and would not accept a trade to Kansas City
A-Rod can opt out of his contract at the end of the year, and would likely not want to stay in KC, so we get him for one year.
It will take way more than Teahen and some B-grade prospects to land A-Rod
We actually really need our B-grade prospects
We can't afford to add A-Rod's salary

But other than those small technicalities, I don't see why this deal can't happen. I also think we should trade John Buck for Manny Ramirez, Joey Gathright for Johan Santana and Reggie Sanders for Dontrelle Willis. I don't know why there isn't more talk of that happening.

Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com

by RoyalsRetro on Mar 22, 2007 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sorry

I come off as a big jerk and I didn't mean to be so.

Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com

by RoyalsRetro on Mar 22, 2007 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

About Time

It is about time that they wake up and realize the he is not going to improve.

by Gordon Rocks on Mar 22, 2007 1:21 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

As I have heard time after time on this site...

2007 doesn't matter anyway. We aren't going to contend so why do anything.

That being said lets take the cheap route, don't do anything. Put Blanco out there as the everyday shortstop. When Grudz comes back at second then rotate German and Blanco. With Gonzo as a day off serviceable backup there you have it. Please jettison Berroa and patch it up until Sanchez is ready or you make a trade. Sanchez needs at least a season at AAA to mature and to develop. If you want to make a trade then with the pressure of the upcoming season off you have a chance to work out a win win situation for us.

Remember, we won't be contending so why worry about it. Or, will we....

by grudz69 on Mar 22, 2007 1:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

This is the only reasonable course of action

Unless we trade for a MLB ready prospect that is blocked by someone...not sure who that would be. The royals have this guy...Sanchez who looks like he might be decent in a couple years...maybe we could trade for him...we've got a couple years before we're going to compete anyway.

If it weren't for baseball I'd be working.

by pd on Mar 22, 2007 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

If Lubnski, Huber and Buckner

wouldn't bring in Wood, why the hell would Sweeney? He has less upside than any of those guys and the Angels have Hillenbrand. I think those three prospects or if you sub Lubanski for DeJesus even, would be too tempting for the Angels to pass up. Huber could solve their first base problem, Lubanski has about a year of seasoning before he's ready to be a stud and Buckner will give them depth in their system pithing wise. I would have to say Stoneman would be intrigued at the very least.

royaldaddy-Bob Hamelin's #1 fan

by royaldaddy on Mar 22, 2007 1:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Sweeney's value

Sweeney wouldn't bring Wood at any time this season. And right now, Sweeney wouldn't bring Aybar.

IF Sweeney has a productive and healthy first half, then a team like the Angels could pick him up in July, only owe him $5 million (maybe the Royals would kick in some cash to lessen this figure) and he'd be very valuable for a stretch run. Prospects have upside potential, but Sweeney has talent right now.

Now, as to Royals prospects being traded for Wood. You can't trade a few ok prospects for one great prospect. That only works in video games. Real world GMs won't go for it.

"Huber could solve their first base problem"

At best he's a below average offensive 1B. I don't see how that solves their problem.

"Lubanski has about a year of seasoning before he's ready to be a stud"

Few scouts think Lubanski is going to be a stud. Decent 4th OFer is more likely. There's a reason that Lubanski wasn't on BA or BP's top 100 prospect list. He also wasn't on Roto's top 150 list. His upside is seriously limited.

"Buckner will give them depth in their system pithing wise"

Adding a little depth with a B prospect isn't worth much.

Those three don't add up to Brandon Wood. Not even close, in my humble opinion. I wish they did.

by NYRoyal on Mar 22, 2007 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was aware of A-Rod's contract status

and I should have said we should only do this if we could get him to agree to an extention of, say, 3 years or so.

As for A-Rod not wanting to come here - who knows? Maybe he is fed up with the NY situation (possible), maybe a talk with GMDM would convince him that KC is an up and coming team, maybe he would want to be the alpha dog of a team again.

I really don't see how Teahen/Sweeney/two prospects for A-Rod in a contract year equates to acquiring Ramirez for Buck or Santana or Gathright or Willis for Sanders. That is really an unfair, sarcastic post, RR!

I was just exploring the possibility of actually filling the shortstop void with a great shortstop instead of a stop gap; if you can suggest alternative packages that make more sense, I would be glad to read them.

by loyal2s dad on Mar 22, 2007 1:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

A-Rod's 3-year extension

"I should have said we should only do this if we could get him to agree to an extention of, say, 3 years or so."

The Royals couldn't even come close to affording what it would take to sign A-Rod to a 3-year extension. Did you see how much salaries went up this offseason? A-Rod would go for HUGE money. There is no way the Royals can afford that. If they did shell out that money to him for some reason, there would be zero money left to pay for any other FA's or even regular raises for other players. It would sink this organization for the next 3 years. A team like the Royals can't afford to spend 1/4 of its payroll on one player, even if it is A-Rod.

by NYRoyal on Mar 22, 2007 1:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Forgot to address the affordibility

Yes, it would add cost, but only about 10-15 million, not the full 25 million A-Rod makes, becuase we are moving Sweeney.

Granted, cost would be higher in 2008 thru 2010 if we get the contract extension of A-Rod, but here's what I'm thinking:

The team starts to turn the corner, ticket sales rocket up next year (partly due to A-Rod), etc. etc.

Generally, small market teams are advised not to have too high a percentage of their payroll tied up in one player, but when you are talking about one of the best players of all time, perhaps that axiom can be thrown out the window.

Imagine the message this would send to all of baseball! Our team would immediately be taken seriously again, with all the ancilliary benefits that would entail. It could ultimately prove to be the "shot across the bow" that launches the Royals back into national prominence.

by loyal2s dad on Mar 22, 2007 1:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

But we can afford

to spend two fifths of our payroll on two players (Sweeney and Meche)?

by loyal2s dad on Mar 22, 2007 1:49 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Sweeney is on his way out

Sweeney is coming off the books after this season. He takes up too much of the payroll now, but that will be rectified.

DM shouldn't repeat and double the Royals Sweeney mistake by signing A-Rod to a contract which will take up 25% of the payroll.

And A-Rod will get over $15 million per year from someone. And I'll bet my salary that it will be for more than 3 years.

by NYRoyal on Mar 22, 2007 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

LMAO

Pounding on your steering wheel while yelling at an inanimate object (radio)?

You might be my distant cousin, BITD.

by loyal2s dad on Mar 22, 2007 5:44 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

The way it should've worked

In a way, this is all Dayton and Buddy's fault. Stick with me on this. Mark Teahen is athletic and gifted enough to play short and nobody can tell me he's not. The fans called for this when the topic of Gordon playing third came up. We all wanted Teahen at short. But, oh no! "Teahen can't play short". They could say that, but they can't give any kind of reason as to why the hell he couldn't. I still believe that this is a possibility that Teahen could move to short, Reggie goes to right until the deadline, then it's Butler time. Am I alone in this estimation. It's a move over one spot, not brain surgery. He could do it.

royaldaddy-Bob Hamelin's #1 fan

by royaldaddy on Mar 22, 2007 6:53 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

hellz yea

hellz freakin' yea

FIRE BELL

by FireBell on Mar 22, 2007 7:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't know

It takes more than athleticism to play SS. It is pretty rare for a 3B to convert to SS. Teahen has good range for a 3B, but I doubt he'd have even decent range for a 3B. There is a huge difference between corner IF defense and middle IF defense, particularly SS.

by NYRoyal on Mar 22, 2007 9:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

At 6-3 215

Teahen is way too big and long to play shortstop regularly. Most SS are smaller and quicker. Glaus is 6-5 240 but he only plays SS a couple games a year in interleague where the defensive sacrifice is acceptable for the bat to be in the lineup.

Just for information

Tejada 5-9
O. Cabrera 5-9
Lugo 6-1
Uribe 6-0
Peralta 6-1
Guillen 6-1
Bartlett 6-0
Crosby (listed 6-3 but i know he aint that tall)
Betancort 5-10
Young 6-1
Drew 6-1

Anyways, the point is that Teahen doesn't have the physical build to be a shortstop. Hes too long in the legs with a well built frame too. Guys like Crosby and Tulowitzki are built more stout and are shorter in the legs.

by wildthang on Mar 23, 2007 2:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Right on Dude

IMO we need to get over the Teahen (and Gordon) at SS fantasy. Teahen didn't show great range/quickness/glove skills at 3B, let alone SS. For an extremely in depth analysis of this possibility see:
http://mvn.com/mlb-royals/2007/03/21/royals-shortstop-woes-not-easily-solved/

by chukar on Mar 23, 2007 3:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think the point isn't...

that Teahen would be an amazing SS or anything. I think the point is that Teahen probably won't be much worse than Berroa and at least Teahen would give us a plus bat at the SS position. Then we'd be able to let Buddy move Gathright out to RF and give our offense a huge boost.

Seriously, if Teahen did move to SS, who is going to cover his OF spot? Sanders or Gathright is the realistic choice...and that makes me throw up in my mouth a little bit.

"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Mar 23, 2007 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Shocker

Tubby Smith left UK before Buddisimo left KC

discuss

FIRE BELL

by FireBell on Mar 22, 2007 7:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm with Grudz, go with Blanco short term

I'm shocked they would consider Barmes or McDonald when they can just plug Blanco in for better defense than those guys and probably the same pathetic offense.

Had a horrible day, then arrive at RR to the great news of Berroa and all is well. But I'm really worried about Hudson now.

by chukar on Mar 22, 2007 11:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

How Does This Help?

How do Barmes or Macdonald make anything better? I'd take Teahen's crappy range to get his bat and general attitude, I think, before either of those guys.

Now Aybar or Wood... hm... now you're talking.

Top Baseball Prospects and Fantasy Tools at ScoutingBook.com

by scoutingbook on Mar 23, 2007 5:28 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Back to the A-Rod debate

I want to attempt to defend my suggestion one more time. Last night, my weekly SI issue came in the mail, and it was the baseball preview issue.

Reading the Royals page, there is an actual quote from GMDM where he suggests he ultimately wants to get the attendance back to 2 million, and the payroll up to $80 million.

Granted, acquiring an A-Rod might not make sense until we are actually in contention, but I couldn't help but do the math. Currently, we are at about 55 - 60 million payroll, and adding A-Rod would only be about 15 -20 million. (Remember, Tex is still on the hook for about 10 million per year of the next 3 seasons).

Just saying...

by loyal2s dad on Mar 23, 2007 10:40 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hey loyal,

that 80M looks good in print, surprised he could say that publicly. As for Arod, I think the biggest strike against it is his no trade. Remember this guy is both egocentric and metrosexual. He just wouldn't see himself in KC.

BTW, tying Arod to the increase in attendance that gets us to 80M is an interesting question. There's a Harvard business school case that treats the Rangers acquiring Arod as a capital budgeting decision. It attempts to predict increased attendance and franchise value based on his added wins. Of course the result is there just aren't any realistic assumptions that justify the contract. I've played with the spreadsheet as a simulation and it's a pretty fun way to gauge contract values in general.

Anyway, here are the actual Rangers attendance and wins numbers before and after Arod:
2000 (before) 2.8M 71
2001 2.8M 73
2002 2.3M 72
2003 2.1M 71
2004 (after)2.5M 89

Quite painful for Tom Hicks.

by chukar on Mar 23, 2007 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was surprised, but VERY encouraged

that he said what he did in print. Naturally, we can't assume he will be able to do it, but damnit, this is sure a refreshing change from the previous regime! I'd rather have a guy aim high and fail than what we did previously; i.e., whine and complain how the deck was stacked against the small market teams...

by loyal2s dad on Mar 23, 2007 2:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs